Charlotte withdrawing from Olympics?

[PaddockWood]

@tohorse

THAT SAID if the crop is like any of the other plastic longing crops I’ve ever owned and is not some adapted version with an actual heavy rope with knots to it (think a carrot stick), it makes a lot of sound, looks horrible and wraps around the legs but is pretty damn ineffective to even cause a serious bruise let alone welts. I may just happen to know this because I’ve been chased like that as a teenager by a coach with his horse before and ended up taking it instead of the horse.

Interesting. I recall a recent video by the great vet Ivanna Ruddock who dissects horses and her pointing out how we can’t see bruising because of their coat color. And then to somehow justify whipping repeatedly. There are no words.

[BLBGP]

I know a lot of people are expressing outrage and disappointment on this thread. But if a reporter read through all this, they could certainly have a case that 1. equestrians see this all the time in every barn and don’t report it, 2. have heard ‘whispers in the dark’ gossip about her from witnesses who didn’t report it for years and no one spoke up, 3. some are upset that it was reported right before the Olympics instead of some other time, and 4. quite a few are focused on trying to find out who reported it.

[Warmblood1]

What does it matter if 2.5 years have passed? Charlottes behavior is atrocious and abusive towards the horse. It should be put in the spotlight and condemned, period. Time passed is irrelevant.

The video is much worst then I thought. I’m really disappointed that such a talented and knowledgeable rider would stoop to using such unfair and abusive tactics. Hate to see Charlotte fall, but if we don’t shun these types of players, they will sabotage and destroy the sport for everyone else.

[SMF11]

@LadyB

Just scary what is out there. From what the rumour mills say, every BNT seems to be shit with their training methods. I will not paint all with the same brush, but I sure don’t believe there are that many good BNT’s out there.

100% this. Bad behavior is totally rewarded in yhe horse world, in all disciplines. Anytime money and an animal’s interest collide, the animal loses. And the horse world, with virtually zero licensing/standards lets anyone hang out a shingle and call themselves a trainer. People who are manipulative (stealing clients, drugging horses, screwing people over etc etc) are rewarded. If they are good at the manipulatng, they get the clients! They win the ribbons with the drugged horses (yes, even at recognized shows)! And that’s even before we get to the animal abuse.

I am sick of the bad behavior in this industry.

[2bayboys]

@BLBGP

I know a lot of people are expressing outrage and disappointment on this thread. But if a reporter read through all this, they could certainly have a case that 1. equestrians see this all the time in every barn and don’t report it, 2. have heard ‘whispers in the dark’ gossip about her from witnesses who didn’t report it for years and no one spoke up, 3. now are upset that it was reported right before the Olympics instead of some other time, and 4. many are trying to find out who reported it.

Or PETA. Or anyone with an agenda against horse sports or the use of any animals in sport.

[Libera]

Well if it was indeed Alicia reporting it, that puts to bed the rumors it was someone trying to sabotage the olympics to give their own team a better chance

[Djones]

So explain the brutality foisted upon western pleasure horses in pursuit of low and flat and slow.

This isn’t brain injury, this is greed and ego.

[PaddockWood]

I don’t know. I’ve never seen whipping a horse like that in any barn I’ve been in and could not stay at one. And yes, likely releasing the video now is strategic. I could care less. That it was done years ago or not. Seeing her do this tells me she probably has done it many more times than once.

[sparkygrace]

This is so shocking and sad. The video is damning and not at all what I expected from her. I attended a two day clinic with her and yes there was lot of yee-haw go forward, but no abuse. She was kind and funny. Now, she has lost everything. Her damehood, her sponsorships, her reputation. There are headlines in major newspapers about removing equestrian sports from the Olympics.

I hope this will be a good lesson for any trainer. Don’t be stupid! Stop before you lose your temper. Know that eyes are on you all the time. If you have to use violence to get a result, you have let your emotions take over or are extremely lacking in skills and knowledge.

[Jealoushe]

This is exactly what my mom said! How is it any different than Big Lick! Just keep smacking to get those hocks higher!

[jcc813]

It sounds like she did reach out to some people asking for advice and they told her to keep quiet.

We’ve already read several people in this thread saying they’ve seen questionable behavior and didn’t report it.

Ultimately, what’s the point of questioning the motive/timing of the whistleblower? The bottom line is they did end up doing the right thing and now hopefully appropriate actions will be taken.

[SMF11]

Wait, “horses don’t understand kindness”?

Are you freaking kidding me??? Are you a trainer?

The other part of your post, I agree with. If it’s a matter of safety, of course it’s fine to whack a horse so they don’t, say, run you over. My personal rule of thumb is, if there’s a situation in which one of us is going to get hurt, it isn’t going to be me. But protecting yourself is a far cry from abusive training methods!

[K_VanOlst]

@Jackie_Cochran

When I read on here of experience and revered dressage riders, teachers and trainers suddenly “losing it” I end up wondering WHY this happens.

Many years ago I came up with a hypothesis–that too much sitting trot is bad for the riders’ brains and spinal cords. Eventually the bruises
of the pre-frontal cortex repeatedly hitting the skull and the brain stem and spinal cord repeatedly “tearing” at the spinal cord all add up and that person can change from being a good rider to being an abusive rider.

I have MS. I ALREADY have lesions on my brain and spinal cord. Nowadays I refuse to go more than 6 strides of the sitting trot on horses with decent sitting trots, on the horses with super stuff backs I refuse to “sit” more than 3 strides of the sitting trot.

I am glad that TBIs are now acknowledged to be a danger from falling off a horse. Maybe we should also acknowledge that the repeated brain and spinal cord trauma from doing a lot of sitting trot is also bad for human beings’ brains.

I know that dressage riders may not believe me about this. I really do not care as I will go on trying to protect my brain and spinal cord while riding horses. But I think that many dressage riders would benefit from stopping slamming their pre-frontal cortexes against the rigid skull.

And no, I don’t have any proof. I just came up with this hypothesis back in the days of Rollkur as an “explanation” of why so many otherwise good horsewomen all of a sudden started abusing their horses with Rollkur, contrary to the writings of just about every leading dressage rider for the last few centuries.

This is, quite possibly, one of the most unhinged thing I have ever read on CoTH… And that is really saying something

[Jealoushe]

Source?

[SMF11]

It’s not, and all the abuse needs to be called out and stopped!

[Jackie_Cochran]

I was specifically talking about dressage riders, especially those who pride themselves on being able to sit the big trots of modern competition dressage horses.

I find the Western horses jogs to be easier on my back because those horses’ hind legs do not PUSH as much at any speed of trot. Even with them I limit sitting the trot.

[Libera]

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/CwsqkYMJ5VX7Ahgf/?mibextid=WC7FNe

[FitzE]

@sparkygrace

Don’t be stupid! Stop before you lose your temper.

I’ve seen several posters here reference the fact that she lost her temper or got to this point or was taking out her frustrations on the horse.

I saw something very different. She is so cool and casual in her violence against that horse that it strikes me as far more likely that this was business as usual, not a crime of passion, if you will.

Watching her hit that horse repeatedly in the absence of other signs of anger (raised voice, red in the face, spectators reacting with laughter and chatting, not silence while someone has temper tantrum, ect.) was the most chilling part of it, for me.

I’ll add my voice to those saying they’ve never seen anything like this in their equestrian experience.

I don’t get the point of saying, ‘I wonder how many of you [us little people I guess?] have ever been at an upper level barn’. So what? Why should this change our genuine reactions to abuse? If it changes yours b/c you are in BNT/upper-level land than that’s a you problem, not those of us who are horrified and for whom this behaviour has not been normalised.

It’s like me scoffing, ‘You all act like you’ve never eaten three meals in one day at Michelin-starred restaurants ’ just b/c I live in one of the food capitals of the world and even my local pizzeria has a Michelin star.

Upper level is a place few people get to. If those of us below that level (or nowhere even near it) don’t and haven’t seen this and find it horrific, that’s a good thing, not a bad thing. It is OUR reaction that should be normalised, not the acceptance of those among us who have been in the rarified upper-level facilities and see it day in/day out at every single facility they’ve been to.

It’s not at all farcical to either recoil in horror or state factually that we’ve never been in the presence of such behaviour for those of us among the great unwashed outside the upper-level barn bubble.

[PaddockWood]

@FitzE

I saw something very different. She is so cool and casual in her violence against that horse that it strikes me as far more likely that this was business as usual, not a crime of passion, if you will.

Watching her hit that horse repeatedly in the absence of other signs of anger (raised voice, red in the face, spectators reacting with laughter and chatting, not silence while someone has temper tantrum, ect.) was the most chilling part of it, for me.

Very good point. Chilling.

[alicen]

@Jealoushe

This trainer has a barn full of horses and students that all don’t seem bothered one bit. Just waiting for the day she’s reported.

And you’re saying nothing because …?