CREST Toothpaste for Sarcoids?

[kdow]

[QUOTE=deltawave;4943602]
Did LSJ move on to a higher plane of existence? Good riddance. Plenty of plants contain iron, but the iron found in animal sources is a lot more bioavailable to us. But vitamin B12 is often a bigger problem (and a legitimate potential cause of anemia in its own right; although it’s very different WRT lab values and not “iron deficiency” anemia, the end result is the same) for “pure” vegetarians.[/QUOTE]

Apparently in the bit that I quoted, the part that talked about iron from different sources was unclear.

(Just to throw more confusion into the mix - a lot of vegetarian and vegan diets rely heavily on tofu as a protein source, which can be problematic for some people due to the fact that soy contains something that mimics estrogen. Yet another possible health problem due to a vegetarian/vegan diet!)

(I should add that I know it’s not THAT common, but it depends on what you eat and how sensitive you are to the hormones. Someone with existing hormonal imbalance issues or who knows they’re particularly sensitive to estrogen for whatever reason should probably tread carefully.)

[caballus]

Gotta luv all the assumptions or is there lack in fully reading what is written? I said I don’t vaccinate. I didn’t say my animals have never been vaccinated.

The only animals in MA that are REQUIRED to be vaccinated against Rabies are dogs, cats and ferrets.

Don’t know where or what LSJ is or doing.

Vit B12 is found in eggs and dairy, is it not? And many foods have added B12 to them, correct? While vegans don’t eat eggs and dairy they do eat foods (I would assume so anyway) that have added B12. But maybe not enough … who knows? I’m not that familiar with “veganism”.

For those who say that Homeopathics don’t work for something, can you prove it? Samuel Hahnemann said Hom. is the only medicine that can ‘cure’.

[Bluey]

—“For those who say that Homeopathics don’t work for something, can you prove it? Samuel Hahnemann said Hom. is the only medicine that can ‘cure’”—

Sorry, that was the most inane question I have read in long time.
The ones postulating any theory are the ones that need to prove “it works”, not the other way around.:lol:

There is plenty of proof tetanus vaccines work.

I find it worrysome when people put themselves, the ones they are in charge of and the rest of society in harm’s way for some kind of odd principles, like not vaccinating and believing in unproven, snake oil type stuff.

Ok when it is harmless, not ok when we are talking of serious diseases like tetanus.:eek:

I have seen horses and cattle die from tetanus and one stallion, that happen to survive, that was just late with his vaccine when he was infected, so had some protection.
Even then, it took half a year of excellent supportive care to pull him thru.

I think it is terrible not to vaccinate, that is proven to protect, when lives can be at stake.:no:

[caballus]

In other words, Bluey, you’ve not studied Homeopathy nor have a full working knowledge of the history or the present-day practice of Homeopathy. There’s hundreds of years of “proof” that Homeopathy works.

You’ve stated opinions. Others have differing opinions.

[dalpal]

[QUOTE=Bluey;4943835]
—“For those who say that Homeopathics don’t work for something, can you prove it? Samuel Hahnemann said Hom. is the only medicine that can ‘cure’”—

Sorry, that was the most inane question I have read in long time.
The ones postulating any theory are the ones that need to prove “it works”, not the other way around.:lol:

There is plenty of proof tetanus vaccines work.

I find it worrysome when people put themselves, the ones they are in charge of and the rest of society in harm’s way for some kind of odd principles, like not vaccinating and believing in unproven, snake oil type stuff.

Ok when it is harmless, not ok when we are talking of serious diseases like tetanus.:eek:

I have seen horses and cattle die from tetanus and one stallion, that happen to survive, that was just late with his vaccine when he was infected, so had some protection.
Even then, it took half a year of excellent supportive care to pull him thru.

I think it is terrible not to vaccinate, that is proven to protect, when lives can be at stake.:no:[/QUOTE]

Yeah, cause we don’t ever overvaccinate do we? :rolleyes: I feel just as strongly about vets who demand that pets have vaccines once a year when it’s not warranted. I’m one of those horrible people who only vaccinate my dogs/cats for rabies, and nothing else. I have always vaccinated the horses once a year because I board them…but if they were at home, not going anywhere…wouldn’t vaccinate them for every damn thing either.

Here’s a great example with the Lepto vaccine…a girl on a different message board had a dog in dire or straights at the vet clinic and no one could figure out why…I had just finished researching the Lepto vacicne because my vet was determined that I needed to give it…ell the symptoms sounded like Lepto. When I posted this, her response was…“Can’t be Lepto, she’s been vaccinated for that”…No one had ever told this lady that the vaccine only protects from certain strains. Her vets were putting it at the bottom of the list because the dog had been vaccinated/and she was on antibotics anyway, if it was Lepto the antibotics would take care of it… Another poster (who oversees many of the Banfield Hospitals) told her to demand a titer to make sure. Guess what? It came back positive…and suddenly the veterinarians decided the antibotic was not good enough and started her on a different one. Dog slowly improved but cost the owner thousands of dollars. If the dog had not been vaccinated for Lepto, it probably would have been a top suspect on the list and the dog would have gotten the correct antibotic earlier.

[dalpal]

[QUOTE=caballus;4943856]
In other words, Bluey, you’ve not studied Homeopathy nor have a full working knowledge of the history or the present-day practice of Homeopathy. There’s hundreds of years of “proof” that Homeopathy works.

You’ve stated opinions. Others have differing opinions.[/QUOTE]

I learned along time ago on COTH that ceratin posters will argue with you till the cows come home because they know they are right and you are wrong. Just easier to put them on the ignore list. :yes:

[Bluey]

[QUOTE=dalpal;4943896]
Yeah, cause we don’t ever overvaccinate do we? :rolleyes: I feel just as strongly about vets who demand that pets have vaccines once a year when it’s not warranted. I’m one of those horrible people who only vaccinate my dogs/cats for rabies, and nothing else. I have always vaccinated the horses once a year because I board them…but if they were at home, not going anywhere…wouldn’t vaccinate them for every damn thing either.[/QUOTE]

A strange logic there, not to vaccinate because some overvaccinate.
Yep, that makes much sense, does it.

[dalpal]

[QUOTE=Bluey;4943899]
A strange logic there, not to vaccinate because some overvaccinate.
Yep, that makes much sense, does it.;)[/QUOTE]

Oh Bluey…I’m not going to argue with you…because you know what, you aren’t going to change my mind nor do I care if I change yours. Just tired of reading your posts where you cram your opinions down everyone else’s throat and godforbid, someone else have a different opinion/reasoning than you. You strike me as one of those folks who just likes to argue. I certainly have my reasons for not jumping on the vaccination bandwagon…but not interested in going there with you because not interested in what you have to offer.

[caballus]

I’m not going to argue either but will post some statements concerning vaccinations written by veterinarians.

(And btw? The initial reason I stopped giving vaccinations was because I overheard my own vet telling someone else in a store that he believed that we “way over vaccinate, causing more harm than good in the long run, but what would vets do without that income?”. That was about 15 years ago! Maybe even longer. I started the ‘research’ on vaccinations at that time.)

I also am posting the list of ‘normal’ behaviors in dogs, cats and horses that is now believed, by many veterinarians, to be directly caused from over-vaccination.

Dr. Ronald D. Schultz, Ph.D…- “Annual revaccination provides no benefit and may increase the risk for adverse reactions. The percentage of vaccinated animals (those vaccinated only as puppies) protected from clinical disease after challenge with canine distemper virus, canine parvovirus and canine adenovirus in the study was greater than 95%.” Current and Future Canine and Feline Vaccination Programs. Dr. Ronald Schultz is a Professor and Chair of the Department of Pathobiological Sciences at the School of Veterinary Medicine, UW-Madison. Schultz, R.D. - Current and Future Canine and Feline Vaccination Programs. Vet Med 3: No. 3, 233-254, 1998

Dr. Charles E Loops DVM - "The first thing that must change with routine vaccinations is the myth that vaccines are not harmful. Veterinarians and animal guardians have to come to realise that they are not protecting animals from disease by annual vaccinations, but in fact, are destroying the health and immune systems of these same animals they love and care for Homeopathic veterinarians and other holistic practitioners have maintained for some time that vaccinations do more harm than they provide benefits. Vaccinations represent a major assault on the body’s immune system…

Dr. Dee Blanco, D.V.M - “You take healthy animals and often very quickly after you vaccinate, you can see simple things like itching of the skin or excessive licking of the paws, sometimes even with no eruptions and licking of the air. We see a lot of epilepsy/seizure, often after a rabies vaccination. Or dogs or cats can become aggressive for several days. Frequently, you’ll see urinary tract infections in cats, often within three months after their [annual] vaccination. If you step back, open your mind and heart, you’ll start to see patterns of illness post-vaccination.”

There are many more but won’t go on posting here. I’ll post the list of ‘normal’ behaviors that have been found to be vaccine-related in another post.

[dalpal]

[QUOTE=caballus;4943938]
I’m not going to argue either but will post some statements concerning vaccinations written by veterinarians.

(And btw? The initial reason I stopped giving vaccinations was because I overheard my own vet telling someone else in a store that he believed that we “way over vaccinate, causing more harm than good in the long run, but what would vets do without that income?”. That was about 15 years ago! Maybe even longer. I started the ‘research’ on vaccinations at that time.)

I also am posting the list of ‘normal’ behaviors in dogs, cats and horses that is now believed, by many veterinarians, to be directly caused from over-vaccination.

There are many more but won’t go on posting here. I’ll post the list of ‘normal’ behaviors that have been found to be vaccine-related in another post.[/QUOTE]

:yes: And there are actually vets out there who even support (gasp) the idea of a raw diet. My animals are all super healthy…and that’s all that matters to me. I had a rescue about 7 years ago (I followed everything to the tee…vaccines, etc.)…he was always sickly and fragile. Then when he turned the magic number of 12…vet suddenly decided he couldn’t handle vaccines anymore…so recommended that we stop doing them. So let me get this straight, when a dog becomes elderly, they suddenly have the ability to ward these bugs off, that they didn’t have the ability to in their adulthood. That’s what got me researching about vaccines. Titers only in this household. And everyone always comes back with strong titers…so I don’t vaccinate…and the opinions of some COTHERS won’t change my protocal.

[caballus]

[QUOTE=dalpal;4943942]
:yes: And there are actually vets out there who even support (gasp) the idea of a raw diet. My animals are all super healthy…and that’s all that matters to me. I had a rescue about 7 years ago (I followed everything to the tee…vaccines, etc.)…he was always sickly and fragile. Then when he turned the magic number of 12…vet suddenly decided he couldn’t handle vaccines anymore…so recommended that we stop doing them. So let me get this straight, when a dog becomes elderly, they suddenly have the ability to ward these bugs off, that they didn’t have the ability to in their adulthood. That’s what got me researching about vaccines. Titers only in this household. And everyone always comes back with strong titers…so I don’t vaccinate…and the opinions of some COTHERS won’t change my protocal.[/QUOTE]

Quick examples of vaccine-related incidents:

Most recently: Son’s 3 year old bitch (family dog) was vaccinated with Rabies and Distemper plus given Flea/Tick repellent in pill form. About 10 days later dog refused to eat. Had trouble drinking. 4 days later, attacked her ‘best friend’, another family canine member, mauled him to death. During the following week was hypersensitive to touch, noise, light and trembled non-stop, ‘hiding’ in bathroom, under beds, in closets. Was reported to vet (who also tended fatal wounds of other dog) who said, “She’s got PMS. That’s all” … Dog is slowly recovering back to “normal behavior”.

Grandson immunized with DTP at 6 months old (If I remember correctly, his age). 7 days later came down with full blown Pertussis. Father and brother, both vaccinated against it as well, also came down with full blown Pertussis.

Another grandson received Flu Shot. Within hours went into grand mal seizure.

Grandson, same one with the Pertussis, recently Dx’d with “Serum Sickness”. Out of the blue – normal, active, healthy, robust 3 yr. old kid. Joints so swollen and painful he can’t walk. Giant hives all over his body. Lymph nodes the size of golfballs on his head.

Close friends son immunized with normal child’s vaccinations. Was ‘normal’ until about 2 weeks after shots. Rapid decline into “Autism”.

Another friend’s daughter … normal in all respects until 2 years old after given routine vaccinations. Declined from there. Now 15 years old with the mentality of a 3 year old.

Friend’s family dog vaccinated against Distemper. Dog attacked family members a week later. Was euthanized.

Just yesterday I learned – client’s horse vaccinated against West Nile. Horse rapidly declined and could lower head past chest by 4 hours post vaccine. Neck swollen twice its size. “Life saving” treatments for 2 weeks post. Horse is slowly recovering and just returned out to pasture for the days. Neck is still swollen and horse is still ‘off’ a bit.

and so on and so forth and so on and so forth …

[caballus]

In order to maintain our animal companions in optimal health, it is extremely important to understand the distinction between common and normal. When the body is in a state of optimal health, all systems are in equilibrium and no external manifestations of imbalance (symptoms) are apparent. Many of the subtle changes we observe in our pets are early warning signs that there is imbalance existing deep within the body. These are not “diseases” per se but
rather are commonly observed deviations from this state of equilibrium. Recognizing and treating these common but abnormal early warning signs are critical to preventing more serious problems in the future.
Many of these symptoms are created by what has been recognized as a chronic form of vaccine damage, called “Vaccinosis”.

Some of these symptoms are as follows:
Runny or Red Eyes
Intermittent Vomiting
Intermittent loose stools, “sensitive stomachs”, allergies to species appropriate foods.
Eating stools, dirt, plastic, rocks, or other indigestible substances
Straining to defecate
Gassiness
Excessive thirst, drinking from water hose, biting water.
Fear or drinking, fear or water, fear of baths.
Gum redness.
Runny nose
Frequent or difficult urination
Loss of pigment from nose, pads, eye rims, or coat.
Red ears, warm ears, excessive ear wax, frequent ear infections.
Rough, dry nose, pads, or coat.
Fearfulness, Anxiety, Fear of Touch, Fear of Strangers, Fear or approach.
Jealousy, Neediness, Possessive behavior with toys, food, etc.
Aggressive behavior with other dogs or humans.
High “prey drive”. Need to chase squirrels, birds, etc.
Compulsive behaviors or any kind.
“Nipping” at heels, nipping at hands, “mouthy” behavior.
Anal gland problems. Scooting.
Excess shedding
Seasonal allergies
Picky or excessive appetite
Stiffness
These are some of the symptoms that are common but are the result of the chronic effects
specific vaccines have on the immune system and the life force of our animals:
Chronic signs of Distemper:
Watery fluid dripping from the nose
Conjunctivitis, eye discharge, entropion
Chronic gastritis, hepatitis, pancreatitis, appetite disorders
Recurrent diarrhea
Sensitivity to food with resulting diarrhea
Epilepsy, Seizures, rear leg paralysis, spondylitis, “shaking leg syndrome”
Lip fold dermatitis
Excessive licking of feet, eruptions between the toes, allergies
Kennel cough, chronic bronchitis and chronic Pneumonia
Chronic skin eruptions, especially those located in the lower half of the body
Failure to thrive, failure to put on weight, quick weight loss.
Focal seizures (licking the air, chasing “imaginary bugs”, etc.)
HOD, Pano, OCD and possibly HD
Chronic signs of Parvo:
Cardiomyopathy, heart murmurs, enlargement of the heart, valve disease.
Bloat, IBD, IBS, “leaky gut syndrome”
Vomiting of bile hours after eating
Flatulence
Bad smelling stools (without the typical Parvo smell).
Irregular pulse, irregular heart beats, heart failure
Chronic signs of Rabies:
Restless nature, moves from place to place
Desire to escape, cannot be contained, digging under fences, jumping fences, etc.
Suspicion of others, fear of touch, fear of humans (sometimes fear of men or fear of
women)
Aggression to animals and people
Clingy, separation anxiety, “velcro dog”
Fear of thunder, storms, rain, gun shots, fireworks
Restraining can lead to violent behavior and/or self injury
Self mutilation, tail chewing, obsessive licking of feet, walls, carpets, humans
High pitch barking, hoarseness, excessive barking
Paralysis of throat or tongue or jaws (lock jaw)
Sloppy eaters, sloppy drinkers, drooling
Dry eye, loss of sight, cataracts
Eating indigestible things (wood, rocks, sticks, paper, dirt, stool)
Insatiable hunger or lack of appetite
Excessive drinking or total lack of thirst
Obsessive behavior towards water (fear or water, or constant desire to be in the water.
Biting of water coming out of a hose)
Obsessive behaviors of all kinds (constant desire to play frisbee or ball, over and over)
Fear or aggression of shiny objects (mirrors, glass, flashlights, etc.)
Destructive behavior (tearing up shoes, bedding, blankets, etc.)
Seizures, epilepsy, twitching while sleeping
Increased sexual desire, sexual aggression, jealousy
Reversed sneezing
There are also many well studied and diagnosed auto-immune diseases such as:
Auto-immune thyroiditis
Lupus
Red Cell aplasia
Auto-immune Hemolytic Anemia
Neoplasias such as fibrosarcomas, mast cell tumors, lipomas, warts, etc.

(this is a list I found in a brochure and I copied it for my own files. I do not have the name of the author of this list nor do I have the brochure any longer. )

[Thomas_1]

Gwen,

You’ve taken your conspiracy theory and junk science to another level!

Basically it seems that anything that can ever be considered “not quite right” is down to vaccinations!

So from farting a lot to increased sexual desire to autoimmune hemolytic anemia all because of vaccination!!! And very thirst or not drinking just the same!!!

You even included tetanus and rabies!!! Are you mad???

Unbelievable.

And I REALLY mean UNBELIEVABLE.

[deltawave]

So because there are adverse reactions to vaccinations, that means vaccinations should be done away with? Sure would be nice to do away with the diseases themselves, wouldn’t it? Life isn’t fair. Sht happens. Give me the best odds I can get, for me and mine. And when I’m the one responsible for deciding, please give me the best information available, from the best minds, and the largest pool of evidence. Of course when one fundamentally rejects science, one has the luxury of substituting belief for knowledge freely and randomly. God help the ones that rely on these decision-makers when the sht hits the fan. Ever watched a kid or a horse die from a 100% preventable disease? :no: :sigh: I have.

[deltawave]

Gwen, you get the “copy and paste” award. And you take great pride in not having any of the actual sources, don’t you? What does your own synthesis of the information you vomit forth tell you? Because surely someone who purports to always be on the search for the TRUTH looks at ALL sides of the issue, no?

[deltawave]

Here’s a thrilling and blood-curdling anecdote. Last time I had my small herd vaccinated . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. Horses went back to eating hay. The time before that . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. And the time before that (here’s the shocking part) . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. Incredible!

[Thomas_1]

[QUOTE=deltawave;4944061]
Here’s a thrilling and blood-curdling anecdote. Last time I had my small herd vaccinated . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. Horses went back to eating hay. The time before that . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. And the time before that (here’s the shocking part) . . . NOTHING HAPPENED. Incredible![/QUOTE] Hey that’s really worrying !

Nothing happened to mine either.

Do you think that’s because of the vaccine?

I’m wondering though if it’s in Gwen’s listing as Picky or excessive appetite?

What do you think? Standing about just eating hay could well be because of vaccination.

[Mara]

In conclusion, I think we can now take Gwen’s “research” and conclude the following:

All modern medicine is bad. The End.

[caballus]

@Thomas_1;4944027

Gwen,

You’ve taken your conspiracy theory and junk science to another level!

I’ve taken nothing to any level except to post veterinary accounts that I’ve read as well as personal experiences.

Basically it seems that anything that can ever be considered “not quite right” is down to vaccinations!

So from farting a lot to increased sexual desire to autoimmune hemolytic anemia all because of vaccination!!! And very thirst or not drinking just the same!!!

You even included tetanus and rabies!!! Are you mad???

Unbelievable.

And I REALLY mean UNBELIEVABLE.

Oh! Didn’t I tell you? Yeah – I had my rabies and tetanus shots just the other day! I’m m.a.d. … for sure! Better watch out! I may bite. :rolleyes:

If you have a problem with the QUOTES that I listed then take it up with the ones who wrote them or spoke them – those veterinarians whom I quoted.

[caballus]

So, Thomas and Delta … you’ve both attested to nothing happening to your horses after vaccinations. Can you attest to what is going on internally – how the internal bodies are reacting? Can you, with 100% assurety, tell us that NOTHING HAPPENED? If so – tell us, please, how you KNOW that ??? What makes you so sure?