Favorite Classical Trainer Nick Peronace VS USDF Judging Standards

[WXWatcher]

Nick stated:

“I’ve launched a formal complaint with the USEF. I’m NOT GOING ANYWHERE. I’m going to keep turning up at shows and posting each ride on Facebook, public for everyone to see. I’m not going to stop exposing these people. So if you’re a judge and you’re reading this, and I’m in your arena, you had better be honest because EVERYONE is going to be a witness.”

“But believe me now when I say that the higher level I compete, the more people are going to care what I have to say. I will not stop exposing corruption and show ring politics! Borrowing a line from our great President Donald Trump, it’s time to drain the swamp!”

---

When I started the thread it was due to Nick’s accusation of corruption. If I am reading this correctly, besides the subtle possible threat he is making towards the judges (he would only write/complain, not physically attack), it sounds like if he doesn’t get the scores HE believes are proper, he is going to complain. Admittedly I think he is full of it and wouldn’t send a formal complaint even if he talked about it and said he did. If he ever does, he had better have absolute, rock-solid proof of his accusation.

He also stated (paraphrased) that he has video of the alleged corruption and lies of the judge in the 2nd show on Facebook. No, he does not, at least not viewable by anyone outside of his inner circle of alleged supporters. He opened up his FB supporters group to the public for about 72 hours where there were two video clips, not full rides, shown. One was in warmup the other a snippet of one of the tests, which was a such a bad angle it is nearly impossible to tell what movement he was trying to do…it looked possibly like a shoulder-in to a half-pass. That short clip did absolutely show a much larger than 10M circle which is the required size in both 3-1 and 4-1.

As for the judge posting about his score, no, the judge didn’t. The judge indicated he had given the lowest score he had ever given for a test and at times had problems determining which test the rider (no name specified) was riding; he NEVER mentioned Nick by name and for that matter, if I remember correctly, didn’t even mention the actual location or name of the show; just the city/airport from where he was departing.

People at the show were the ones who identified Nick and with the scores, people put 2 and 2 together. Even if the judge had not made such a public comment (rightly or wrongly), the USDF scores show the name of the show and the judge. Anyone doing a search on Nick’s name for scores would have pulled up the same info regardless if anyone had posted that he had shown.

[Gestalt]

I looked at CenterlineScores but nothing came up. How are you finding his scores? (Please )

[WXWatcher]

@Gestalt

I looked at CenterlineScores but nothing came up. How are you finding his scores? (Please )

Centerline indicated they were having issues with their systems and were supposed to reload scores but some still aren’t showing. All scores can still be accessed via the USDF site itself which is where Centerline pulls from anyway.

https://www.usdf.org/usdfscores/

[Dr_Doolittle]

I am reminded of this famous line:

https://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/g/grouchomar128465.html

[BigDarnHorse]

Nick’s parents gave him the money to buy Carpathia. There are no behind-the-scenes secret sponsors.

There have been “real” professional riders criticized here on COTH for their horse’s appearance in the past (a certain eventer comes to mind). Observations included the horse looking a bit thin, out of condition, the horse is lacking that “bloom”, etc. It chaps my hide to see someone (Nick) making obvious excuses for their horse looking less than ideal.

Thanks to smoofox, I am now considering suing the state of Pennsylvania.

[Gestalt]

@WXWatcher

Centerline indicated they were having issues with their systems and were supposed to reload scores but some still aren’t showing. All scores can still be accessed via the USDF site itself which is where Centerline pulls from anyway.

https://www.usdf.org/usdfscores/

Thanks! I couldn’t get anything because there is a member login. I’ll just wait for centerline.

[SendenHorse]

@BigDarnHorse

Nick’s parents gave him the money to buy Carpathia. There are no behind-the-scenes secret sponsors.

really? how do you know this? how interesting but more of the same.

Somethings never change, at least he’s consistent. This isn’t his first forum he’s attacked, you know.

[WXWatcher]

For what it’s worth, Nick is listed as Carpathia’s owner in her USDF registry. USDF requires that the actual owner be recorded on things like show entries.

[ToN_Farm]

@NSC Los Angeles

Nick if you’re still reading this I wanted to offer some nutritional advice for Carpathia. Don’t give up and accept that TBs are going to be hard keepers. For a TB in work you can definitely get them conditioned correctly but if you don’t feed sufficiently they won’t change.

This 12 year old TB gelding with 20 starts is on six flakes a day, Alfalfa and Timothy half and half, three pounds of TDI 16, 2 pounds of rice bran, 1 pound of beet pulp and Platinum CJ. My instruction to the barn staff is to feed so much hay it amounts to continuous forage, there is always hay on the ground. This costs a small fortune but I have no doubt if you feed to this program and have decent hay in your area you have a transformed Carpathia.

Horse feeding is taking this a bit off topic, but since it’s being discussed I’ll comment. It’s already been mentioned that he has moved boarding barns a number of times. Most just assumed it was because he was a problem there. It could well be that he moved due to insufficient feeding, bedding, turnout, ring maintenance, and a host of other things. All one has to do is read the coth horse care forum to see all the problems boarders have with getting enough hay. Not all barns will allow you to bring your own hay and even if you offer to pay more for more hay, it just doesn’t happen. I have my own place, but I have been in many an expensive boarding facility where they fed low quality hay and scrimp on it to boot. So it may not be NP’s fault. Further, I admit I didn’t scrutinize the mare’s appearance but skinny did not pop out at me.

[caper]

I found his scores.

http://www.foxvillage.com/fvdshowresults/(S(izwh0cqsi0u224voxbewso45))/Rider.aspx?sh=4954&rd=299

http://www.foxvillage.com/fvdshowresults/(S(ngj5p5fh1qohgy55phwre2zu))/Class.aspx?sh=4978&cl=31

[Mondo]

I’ve been lurking along here, because really I couldn’t care less about this person or any of the foregoing. It strikes me however, that you are all trying to communicate with someone who [edit]. You can’t reason with this person, he’s delusional. All attempts to do so will get only push back. He is never going to change.

With that in mind, it occurs to me that this is a great example of why we should have some sort of licensing/certification/qualifying system in this country. Yes, we have the USDF Instructor Certification program, but it’s not mandatory, doesn’t really address whether or not you can train a horse, just that you can instruct, and only goes through 4th level.

Just as you have to show recent scores to get into the L program; just as you have to have qualifying scores to do freestyles at a particular level; so you should have to be able to actually demonstrate your “chops” before being allowed to hang out your shingle and call yourself a professional. That would really weed out these types of “trainers.”

[NSC_Los_Angeles]

Yeah that’s quite possible that he’s having problems getting facilities to feed to his instruction, but in my experience they’ll feed what you pay them to feed. I think he’s a very nice rider at training/1st, if he consistently rides as he does in the photos and feeds well I see no reason the horse wouldn’t develop a very nice musculature.

[gailbyrd]

@caper

I found his scores.

http://www.foxvillage.com/fvdshowresults/(S(izwh0cqsi0u224voxbewso45))/Rider.aspx?sh=4954&rd=299

http://www.foxvillage.com/fvdshowresults/(S(ngj5p5fh1qohgy55phwre2zu))/Class.aspx?sh=4978&cl=31

Totally off topic but WOW, did you look at Silva Martin’s scores from that show? 3 horses, same class (3-3), 2% points difference with two of the scores the exact same. Talk about consistency!!!

[trubandloki]

@ToN Farm

Horse feeding is taking this a bit off topic, but since it’s being discussed I’ll comment. It’s already been mentioned that he has moved boarding barns a number of times. Most just assumed it was because he was a problem there. It could well be that he moved due to insufficient feeding, bedding, turnout, ring maintenance, and a host of other things. All one has to do is read the coth horse care forum to see all the problems boarders have with getting enough hay. Not all barns will allow you to bring your own hay and even if you offer to pay more for more hay, it just doesn’t happen. I have my own place, but I have been in many an expensive boarding facility where they fed low quality hay and scrimp on it to boot. So it may not be NP’s fault. Further, I admit I didn’t scrutinize the mare’s appearance but skinny did not pop out at me.

That would be a great explanation if that was his answer, but his answer was she is a TB and TBs are thin.

[KBC]

@trubandloki

That would be a great explanation if that was his answer, but his answer was she is a TB and TBs are thin.

Cos “everybody knows that”

[Belowthesalt]

@trubandloki

That would be a great explanation if that was his answer, but his answer was she is a TB and TBs are thin.

Hah. Well, we all know TBs CAN be hard keepers, but my first two horses were an Appendix mare that had been raced and was 7/8 TB, and the second a full TB. The first was racehorse thin/fit when I got her, but ample good hay, supplemental pellets and grain and it only took a short time to get her up to a healthy saddle horse weight (and this was in the 70s, in San Francisco, in Golden Gate Park - no pasture or extended turnout). I look at the pictures when I showed her only a few weeks after I got her and OMG, she was fit/thin! Today, so many years later, I wouldn’t show a horse that looked like that - but she was healthy and the judge placed her (hunter). The second, also a mare, was in decent weight when I got her (from an H/J trainer). Again, enough good hay, very little grain, and she bloomed - but you do have to keep adjusting, I think - a lot depends upon the amount and type of work as well as the feed program. (SInce 1977 I’ve had Appies - keeping them “fat and happy” has NOT been a problem. LOL. My guy has been on light work due to an injury and I had to cut his feed waaaay back or he would have become obese. Plus, being part Arab, he gets no grain at all.)

[Unfforgettable]

I must wholeheartedly agree with one of his statements, made twice in his recent “interview”:

He said “I’m NOT GOING ANYWHERE.”

That would be absolutely accurate.

His delusions remind me of a child zooming up and down the driveway on their little bike with training wheels and claiming NASCAR drivers don’t know anything about cars or driving.

[maunder]

At risk of derailing the subject - but because it’s a topic near and dear to my heart. Here is my Thoroughbred the DAY AFTER his last race in December 2008 (and enjoying his first turnout at the home farm). He was fit and fabulous - and not a bit skinny.

[ATTACH=JSON]{“alt”:“Click image for larger version Name: December2008FirstTurnout3.jpg Views: 1 Size: 18.1 KB ID: 9864677”,“data-align”:“none”,“data-attachmentid”:“9864677”,“data-size”:“medium”}[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH=JSON]{“alt”:“Click image for larger version Name: December20081.jpg Views: 1 Size: 20.5 KB ID: 9864679”,“data-align”:“none”,“data-attachmentid”:“9864679”,“data-size”:“medium”}[/ATTACH]

Posting to prove that good race trainers do know how to feed and don’t buy the ‘skinny Thoroughbred’ malarkey.

[BigMama1]

@Mondo

I’ve been lurking along here, because really I couldn’t care less about this person or any of the foregoing. It strikes me however, that you are all trying to communicate with someone [edit]. You can’t reason with this person, he’s delusional. All attempts to do so will get only push back. He is never going to change.

With that in mind, it occurs to me that this is a great example of why we should have some sort of licensing/certification/qualifying system in this country. Yes, we have the USDF Instructor Certification program, but it’s not mandatory, doesn’t really address whether or not you can train a horse, just that you can instruct, and only goes through 4th level.

Just as you have to show recent scores to get into the L program; just as you have to have qualifying scores to do freestyles at a particular level; so you should have to be able to actually demonstrate your “chops” before being allowed to hang out your shingle and call yourself a professional. That would really weed out these types of “trainers.”

I’m not sure how that could be policed or enforced. In Canada we do have a national coaching certification program and the national federation certainly promotes it as being a way to find a good quality coach, but TONS of fantastic coaches and trainers are not certified and frankly knowing some who are - I can say it’s no guarantee of quality. Requiring a recent show record is problematic as well, since many choose to focus on training and teaching and don’t compete themselves. A conundrum.

[NSC_Los_Angeles]

I just want to give two thumbs up to all the tasty thoroughbreds on this thread. Looking great! Stay jacked kids!