Feds just raided AC4H

[MoonoverMississippi]

[QUOTE=mbm;6967816]
how many horses would 50k purchase? assume each horse cost 250 that means they are buying 200 horses a month… really? how are they feeding those 200 horses when all they have is one barn and only pay 2k in feed bills?

my guess is that that is where they are getting their money for living expenses and hopefully the IRS is bright enough to figure that out.[/QUOTE]

The way I understand it from some of the “incidents” mentioned in the past is that they don’t “buy” a “broker” horse until it has somewhere to go, immediately.

As I understood it, they post a horse, collect “donations”, then when the horse finally has a place to go they “buy” it from the KB (because he doesn’t want to deal with the people).
The horse leaves immediately, so there is little/no feed, etc. on the broker horses: only those in the “actual” rescue portion require that expense.

The ownership of the “broker” horses is what is puzzling: sometimes they say they buy them and resell to the new owner to keep the KB out of the mix.

However, when some people have complained about injury, etc., they were told ac4H never owns the horses, they are simply a listing service (for a small fee, of course) who transfers the $$ to the KB immediately, and the sale is actually between the KB and new owner, with the rescue simply an uninterested intermediary to the transaction. So which is it this time?

In addition, I would love to see their paperwork and how a rescue can also broker horses: I think the IRS and Feds may argue unrelated business income, which would be taxable.

[MoonoverMississippi]

[QUOTE=mbm;6967816]
how many horses would 50k purchase? assume each horse cost 250 that means they are buying 200 horses a month… really? how are they feeding those 200 horses when all they have is one barn and only pay 2k in feed bills?

my guess is that that is where they are getting their money for living expenses and hopefully the IRS is bright enough to figure that out.[/QUOTE]

The way I understand it from some of the “incidents” mentioned in the past is that they don’t “buy” a “broker” horse until it has somewhere to go, immediately.

As I understood it, they post a horse, collect “donations”, then when the horse finally has a place to go they “buy” it from the KB (because he doesn’t want to deal with the people).
The horse leaves immediately, so there is little/no feed, etc. on the broker horses: only those in the “actual” rescue portion require that expense.

The ownership of the “broker” horses is what is puzzling: sometimes they say they buy them and resell to the new owner to keep the KB out of the mix.

However, when some people have complained about injury, etc., they were told ac4H never owns the horses, they are simply a listing service (for a small fee, of course) who transfers the $$ to the KB immediately, and the sale is actually between the KB and new owner, with the rescue simply an uninterested intermediary to the transaction. So which is it this time?

In addition, I would love to see their paperwork and how a rescue can also broker horses: I think the IRS and Feds may argue unrelated business income, which would be taxable.

[cjgatesman]

[QUOTE=sunridge1;6965604]
As much as I hate to agree with Fairfax, there will be many ASB’s with real identities that will never get pulled. She pulled them FOR the rescue group. I have horses out there that I’ve sold and AC4H’s was one of my watches along with Camelot. More Saddlebreds will be dead is what I see, unless they go to the Amish. I will with hold my judgement until ALL the facts are presented.[/QUOTE]

Dont think the Amish are great animal lovers. Isnt it conveniet that NH is located where it is: in the middle of Amish country. When they’re through with them, they go to sale.

[trubandloki]

[QUOTE=mbm;6967787]
i have a side question: how can they be paying upwards of 50,000 a MONTH to purchase horses? how many horses would that buy?

also look at the feed bills… around 3 k a month. how many horses would that feed?[/QUOTE]

Clearly, cough cough, 3K worth of feed takes care of 50K worth of horses.

[minnie]

[QUOTE=caffeinated;6967617]
Salaries should be reported on the 990.[/QUOTE]

don’t be silly. If they declare they’re being paid a salary, they’d have to pay taxes on it. Now here’s another thought. If they have no reportable income, do they also get welfare assistance or foodstamps?

[Miss_Aria]

3K in feed? Oh yeah, right. They buy a couple hundred $$s worth of grain a month if that [usually only grain the old ones] and they buy moldy hay mostly at hay auctions. Big squares that they throw in hay feeders outside or shove down the chute under the barn. I can’t tell you how much mold I’ve peeled away from those bales.

[goneriding24]

For all the horses they are buying/trading/whatevs every month, are there really THAT many horses around to support this claim? Somewhere above, someone wrote ACHG (whatever) spent $81K in a month on horses. That’s a lot of horses, even at $500 per. If they are buying for cheaper that’s a lot MORE horses. There are that many horses going through the sales each and ever month? Or are the horses recycled back through, over and over?

[analise]

I think recycling happens. I know of at least one pair of horses that showed up on the AC4H broker list multiple times and I’ve heard of other stories like that. And New Holland is a big auction, I’ve been out there once and there were quite a lot of horses there and it runs every week.

[ReSomething]

Sunridge, I know it’s a shame that ASB may now slip through the cracks, but the reason they were being pulled out was because there was a market for them - Save the poor Saddlebred! As someone else already pointed out there are eyes at NH and Sugarcreek at every auction - they just didn’t have this incestous relationship with the KB.

As I think about it this may be a case of messiah complex on the part of AC4H more than fraud with forethought. It’s too easy to start getting grey with your books if you think you are doing the “right thing”. Or not. Needless to say the IRS plays hardball. They only bring flowers to your funeral.

[jenm]

I’m not sure if this has been posted yet, but found it on Facebook:

ATTENTION VICTIMS OF AC4H: MESSAGE FROM THE FBI OFFICE SPECIAL AGENT CHARLENE TRUX. IF YOU HAVE EVER RECEIVED A SICK, MISREPRESENTED, DEBILITATED OR INCORRECT, OR IF YOU HAVE PAID FOR A ANIMAL AND DID NOT RECEIVE THAT ANIMAL (EXAMPLE, YOU SENT IN YOUR MONEY AND THE HORSE BECAME UNAVAILABE OR WAS DIRECT BAILED BY SOMEONE ELSE, IF HORSE/ANIMAL WAS SWAPPED FOR ANOTHER ANIMAL WITHOUT YOUR KNOWLEDGE OR YOU SENT IN THE TRANSPORT AND THE ANIMAL WAS NOT THERE. THERE ARE MANY EXAMPLES THAT COULD BE LISTED) FROM AC4H, CONTACT SPECIAL AGENT CHARLENE TRUX AT 610-433-6488. IF SPECIAL AGENT CHARLENE TRUX IS NOT AVAILABLE THE SWITCH BOARD OPERATOR WILL TAKE YOUR NAME AND NUMBER AND SHE WILL CALL YOU BACK.

[Fairfax]

[QUOTE=Angela Freda;6967303]
For the millionth time, the difference is that DEF and GG have many neglected and abused horses at their farms for whom they provide day to day care which costs money. That’s what they do. Provide care to neglected and abused horses [like Polish Arabians out of Maryland for example], and rehabilitate them, and find them homes after months and months of doing that rehab and care.

IN FACT you yourself said that this isn’t a cheap undertaking, would you like me to find that quote for you?

AC4H, not 4H, on the other hand is a middle man who takes in all that money but never has the horses [for whom the money comes in] in their care. Ever.

Big Difference.[/QUOTE]

Another time and another thread I will challenge you on the neglected and abused…especially abused statement. Since when is halter training worth $1000 per horse?

Rehab is a common phrase used by rescues and yet most don’t live up to what they claim.

to the other poster…why would they “save the broken down” and sell the useful to slaughter?

Although I was a critic of their charges etc, I never saw that occur on TROT…the Saddlebreds presented were described with accuracy…i.e. from the Amish…a road warrior…lame left front…

Or …clearly able to demonstrate has been a show horse…able to be ridden and picks up on leads…

I expect they had repeat business from the ASB crowd was due to the horses they offered. Not all were saved…of course…and again…I was critical about a fee of $550 and up…if there was only $250.00 raised…they would not drop their price so off to slaughter (or maybe another sale) it went

[sassysmom]

[QUOTE=Angela Freda;6967121]
Hypothetical:

What if… the feedlot owner was related in some way to the ‘rescue’

Than that is really really questionable as inurement and likely to cause an investigation

What if… the sole QT facility the rescue referred people to was run by a relation?[/QUOTE]

referring is ok . an exclusive deal *usually to benefit the private party or business *or spending donated money not so much

. Say the rescue is using donations to pay a buddy’s stable exclusively . That type of deal has to be voted on by the board of directors and the BOD are responsible to make sure this is the best use of funds. This has to submitted to the Attorney General in writing . You cannot even have a board that is made up of relatives. You have to have a quorom , if there are two family members your board has to also have three non relatives. I dont know how half the rescues get past the IRS to get non profit status.
The point of these rules is so that non profits are not phoney ways to avoid paying income tax, workmen’s compensation and payroll tax. How many big rescues that don’t have outside jobs never report payroll . Tons of them. So dirty but again people scream if they pay themselves so they cheat. People don’t look twice at the salvation army paying employees , churches etc but animal rescues are supposed to work full time for free. Its a tightrope act

When you are checking into their 990s also pay attention to independent contractors. This is for people who are not directly related to the business. Say an electrician that comes in once in a while not for someone who is involved with day to day business. Sometimes they will pay themselves or their buddies through that to avoid payroll tax too. This is all depending on them being honest if cash or checks show up in envelopes or they do other creative bookeeping that cant be tracked then who knows what they really bring in or spend

[Fairfax]

[QUOTE=Miss Aria;6967592]
The Amish like to breed minis, and they do so in abundance. AC4H also breeds minis, or at least they did. Supposedly the sale of them would send the kids to college. Yeah, right.

Also, ac4h rents a bank barn with attached dry lot; that’s where the actual rescues live, all grouped together in a herd, including Christy’s personal mare [who also gets bred]. What I would like to know is how those people pay their family bills [you know, mortgage, food, clothing, personal effects, things like that] not affiliated with a rescue when no one works for a living. Money has to be coming from somewhere.[/QUOTE]

The Amish do not educate their children past the eighth grade, believing that the basic knowledge offered up to that point is sufficient to prepare one for the Amish lifestyle.[1][2] Almost no Amish go to high school, much less to college. In many communities, the Amish operate their own schools, which are typically one-room schoolhouses with teachers (young unmarried women) from the Amish community. These schools provide education in many crafts, and are therefore eligible as vocational education, fulfilling the nationwide

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish_life_in_the_modern_world

[goneriding24]

http://www.fbi.gov/philadelphia/contact-us/territory-jurisdiction The above number is legit.

Just had to look it up!

[Paragraph]

[QUOTE=minnie;6967927]
don’t be silly. If they declare they’re being paid a salary, they’d have to pay taxes on it. Now here’s another thought. If they have no reportable income, do they also get welfare assistance or foodstamps? :)[/QUOTE]

Everyone needs to realize that the 990’s that I and other’s refer to is for the income/expenses of the rescue organization. The Shiedy’s and the other officers of Ac4H would also file a personal tax return that would contain their own personal income/exemptions, etc. Personal tax returns are not available to the public unless someone chooses to make them available, or they are a public official who must post them.

All this IRS 990 from Ac4H states is that the rescue is not paying the Shiedy’s any salary. Any personal income the Shiedy’s receive from any other source would be listed on their personal income tax return.

I believe I read a long time ago that Mr.Shiedy receives disability. Whether that is true or not I have no idea.

The FBI is who raided their home this week, not the IRS. The FBI investigates a lot of things, but tax evasion is not in their purvue. That would be the IRS’s jurisdiction. I would assume from the involvement of the FBI and what we were told the search warrant contained, they are investigating internet fraud, money laundering, etc. How interconnected the non profit exemption and any possible charges from the FBI investigation are remains to be seen…as we have seen from the Boston Marathon bombing, the various government agencies seem to not be talking to each other again just like pre-Sept.11.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/investigate/what_we_

[goneriding24]

[QUOTE=Fairfax;6968100]
The Amish do not educate their children past the eighth grade, believing that the basic knowledge offered up to that point is sufficient to prepare one for the Amish lifestyle.[1][2] Almost no Amish go to high school, much less to college. In many communities, the Amish operate their own schools, which are typically one-room schoolhouses with teachers (young unmarried women) from the Amish community. These schools provide education in many crafts, and are therefore eligible as vocational education, fulfilling the nationwide

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish_life_in_the_modern_world[/QUOTE]

Maybe in most parts, but when I drove a big rig in PA, I delivered to a store with an Amish school beside it. They let the boys in the school out to come over to us and help unload the truck. I’m pretty sure there were high school boys in there, or else they have some big eighth graders. Then again, this store had all sorts of produced items in it, things like shampoo and boxed dinners. Maybe they were the progressive arm of Amish, IDK. Not that this has anything to do with the zoo which is going on with this rescue. Entertainment purposes only.

[sassysmom]

What does the Amish lifestyle have to do with the question about a rescue breeding or explain the magical money to pay for living expenses ?

Could have just said oh those damn Amish a , I mean not like they use the internet

[Angela_Freda]

Originally Posted by Miss Aria
The Amish like to breed minis, and they do so in abundance. AC4H also breeds minis, or at least they did. Supposedly the sale of them would send the kids to college. Yeah, right.

[QUOTE=Fairfax;6968100]
The Amish do not educate their children past the eighth grade, believing that the basic knowledge offered up to that point is sufficient to prepare one for the Amish lifestyle.[1][2] Almost no Amish go to high school, much less to college. In many communities, the Amish operate their own schools, which are typically one-room schoolhouses with teachers (young unmarried women) from the Amish community. These schools provide education in many crafts, and are therefore eligible as vocational education, fulfilling the nationwide

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish_life_in_the_modern_world[/QUOTE]

Dude, Aria was talking about the mini flipping being Christys of AC4Hs’ way of saving $$ for her daughters to go to college, not the Amish.

[jenm]

[QUOTE=goneriding24;6968112]
http://www.fbi.gov/philadelphia/contact-us/territory-jurisdiction The above number is legit.

Just had to look it up![/QUOTE]

Haha, I looked it up before I posted, just in case!

[LauraKY]

[QUOTE=sassysmom;6968085]
referring is ok . an exclusive deal *usually to benefit the private party or business *or spending donated money not so much

. Say the rescue is using donations to pay a buddy’s stable exclusively . That type of deal has to be voted on by the board of directors and the BOD are responsible to make sure this is the best use of funds. This has to submitted to the Attorney General in writing . You cannot even have a board that is made up of relatives. You have to have a quorom , if there are two family members your board has to also have three non relatives. I dont know how half the rescues get past the IRS to get non profit status.
The point of these rules is so that non profits are not phoney ways to avoid paying income tax, workmen’s compensation and payroll tax. How many big rescues that don’t have outside jobs never report payroll . Tons of them. So dirty but again people scream if they pay themselves so they cheat. People don’t look twice at the salvation army paying employees , churches etc but animal rescues are supposed to work full time for free. Its a tightrope act

When you are checking into their 990s also pay attention to independent contractors. This is for people who are not directly related to the business. Say an electrician that comes in once in a while not for someone who is involved with day to day business. Sometimes they will pay themselves or their buddies through that to avoid payroll tax too. This is all depending on them being honest if cash or checks show up in envelopes or they do other creative bookeeping that cant be tracked then who knows what they really bring in or spend[/QUOTE]

It’s called breach of fiduciary duty. Incorporation doesn’t protect you, but I believe that errors and omissions insurance will…bet she doesn’t have it. And I’m 99% sure it won’t cover something illegal, even if she does.