One can only hope.
I don’t really know enough of the details of AC4H to make a determination but it would be great if they could put Celeita out of business at a minimum if not behind bars.
[QUOTE=Liberty;6970016]
Oh, but AC4H contacted SWAP (Celeita) to inform her that the KB had him. Deflection, anyone? Or maybe AC4H is trying to pull SWAP down with them?
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.579728422057377.1073741833.113580512005506&type=1#!/permalink.php?story_fbid=579688392061380&id=113580512005506
Yes, this is getting even more interesting![/QUOTE]
I wouldn’t infer anything nefarious here necessarily. The sad fact is that this horse for a fact, and many others like him but not so easily identifiable, can kick around the lower end barns/dealers/rescues for years if they have some redeeming quality that makes ppl not want to send them to the KB.
[QUOTE=luvmytbs;6969945]
Oh, this gets even more interesting:
Celita Kramer claims that AC4H is trying to sell one of her horses.
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.579728422057377.1073741833.113580512005506&type=1[/QUOTE]
Celeita/SWAP comments on the above linked F’book posting that she doesn’t know who the meat buyer is… uh hello?! It’s B Moore.
Google could/would tell you all you need to know about who the meat buyer is that AC4H markets for.
IF you truly do retain ownership as you claim, just contact the police and get the horse, who was technically stolen, back.
That SWAP has done neither a Google search nor contacted the police is interesting… Does anyone other than me smell something?
I have been following this, since AC4H is local to me. I have found it interesting that the local newspaper has not done any coverage on this. Even the “local” news station, that has poor coverage in Berks Co. has featured this story.
Above, “Tee” was mentioned, she also was very local to me. She was running a scam for many years and under many aliases. There was at least one thread on her here at the time of her death.
[QUOTE=Angela Freda;6970360]
Celeita/SWAP comments on the above linked F’book posting that she doesn’t know who the meat buyer is… uh hello?! It’s B Moore.
Google could/would tell you all you need to know about who the meat buyer is that AC4H markets for.
IF you truly do retain ownership as you claim, just contact the police and get the horse, who was technically stolen, back.
That SWAP has done neither a Google search nor contacted the police is interesting… Does anyone other than me smell something?[/QUOTE]
Wow. Too bad someone didn’t snap Rock Doctor up when he was younger. He has a decent pedigree for jumping!
Too bad these horses fall through the cracks.
Has anyone gotten the e-mail from RRTP? They need 26 trainers to take horses off the track and reschool them for a show next October. Not a competition just “makeover.” it is to remember the 26 who died at Newtown.
[QUOTE=LookmaNohands;6970371]
Wow. Too bad someone didn’t snap Rock Doctor up when he was younger. He has a decent pedigree for jumping!
Too bad these horses fall through the cracks.
Has anyone gotten the e-mail from RRTP? They need 26 trainers to take horses off the track and reschool them for a show next October. Not a competition just “makeover.” it is to remember the 26 who died at Newtown.[/QUOTE]
Where did Rock Doctor come from? I know some of SWAPs horses are donations from accomplished riders/trainers… horses who’ve been there, done that who are not making it anymore, so they donate them [do they then get to write the horse off their ins. for loss of use or whatever it is? Kinda like what that org of Jen Alfano’s does, iirc] and SWAP adopts them out…
I am starting to believe this whole rescue “biz” is going to come to a major halt.
And soon
I don’t know Roc Doctor or any of the horses mentioned however I am seeing a pattern.
I expect these horses ARE offered to enthusiasts but there are no buyers…therefore they go to an auction with low enders trying to make a fast buck off them…everyone appears to be flipping the same horse.
Then…a rescue becomes involved with a…we gotta save…this is a great and famous horse…but by that time the horse is auctioned out and a couple of years of dubious care is reflected in is ears to its hooves.
Each time, however, someone is saving a horse…for resale.
All to escape to obvious…
Top name riders don’t want their name attached to a horse that went to slaughter. And the little guys are all trying to make a buck off that name trainers horse.
The more I am reading about the saving, the up and down, the starvation, and what ever else…all in the name of keeping the horse alive is disgusting.
This is like keeping grandma on life support year after year while she has pneumonia, bed sores and a mirad of other issues.
It is time to pull the plug.
I someone wants to save a horse…go to an auction or find someone to do it for you. Buy ONE horse like the young girl who posted…put some work into it and see if you can resell but be prepared to sell at a loss OR keep the horse.
This flipping is more cruel than needing a second shot with a dead bolt.
This flipping of horses in the name of the saving horse religion is keeping the horses in the pipeline…forcing them to travel from sale to sale or farm to farm while a few make a bunch of money off it.
WOW… years of ongoing homelessness cruelty in order to save it from the cruelty of slaughter.
I wonder why their Facebook page has not been shut down? Still on their begging for money.
They will be able to conduct business until they are charged. At that time a judge MAY shut them down OR allow them to continue until conviction or release
Sadly just like in small animal rescue has become the next “big business”. I’m NOT debating the ethics and merrits of “should they be saved”. I am willing to say that especially as of late a lot of recen’t “rescues” are nothing more then mills for those who have fallen into the dregs.
They are easy to pick out , always panhandling , often picking out one mascot with some horrific illness , injury “help donate to so and so’s vet bills”. Followed shortly by "so and so’s vet bills have put us behind “donate to our feed /hay bill”.
Attaching a much higher price or adoption fee to anything with a bit of novelty is also far to common. AC4h and BM are specialists at that. …there was a cute foundation bred OLD welsh mare bred by a famous/fashionable stud. She was old well past broodmare age well past serviceability But if you looked at her bail out price it was double almost everything on the page.
The special circumstances are becoming less special and more common. Especially with the availability of far reaching social media.
I honestly don’t have a problem with brokers flipping horses, even at a profit on their end. If it annoys you …go to the auction and bid against them in the first place.
As long as the process is above board ,brokers are no different then traders and trainers who flip horses. They are being paid for doing the work you didn’t want to do personally.
[QUOTE=LauraKY;6964826]
It’s about time.[/QUOTE]
Right, what took them so long! I guess same thing goes for the Boston Bumbling.
[QUOTE=lolalola;6970213]
I’ve followed AC4H for a long time and interviewed Christy on a few occasions. It seems to have gone south when she got involved with broker horses. Before that, she’d raise money to buy a horse or two from New Holland and rehome them. Once she hooked up with Moore, it wasn’t a horse or two a week but dozens. She also was quite friendly with a woman named “Tee.” Tee died unexpectedly, quite young, with no one claiming her body. It turned out that the name she’d been using was an alias, that she had a criminal record for fraud. She and CS had been tight as ticks, but when Tee died and the truth came out CS never commented about it. I always wondered whether Tee sort of schooled her in the art of the con. Maybe, maybe not, but that’s about when AC4H went from an organization with a fairly good rep to a fairly bad one.[/QUOTE]
Right, desperation for money with poor ethical standards will get you every time. Christy wanted to save her farm, and found a way to do it. Like it or lump it, many, many people do the same. I am sure she has helped many, she also, like Alex Brown also were the means by which many federal frauds and scams were pertetuated. ABR had at the last count facilitated at least five principle scams that resulted in individuals like Mary O’Brien, who was even more unsteady emotionally and intellectually eventually kill dozens as a 501C3, she got hooked on drugs, she also got a slap on the wrist as far as I know. The handwriting is on the wall, it all revolves around the decay of the agricultural, scientific and industrial decay of this nation over the last 40 + years since the death of John and Robert Kennedy, I should say, their assasssination and the subsequent coverup.
[QUOTE=appdream;6970366]
I have been following this, since AC4H is local to me. I have found it interesting that the local newspaper has not done any coverage on this. Even the “local” news station, that has poor coverage in Berks Co. has featured this story.
Above, “Tee” was mentioned, she also was very local to me. She was running a scam for many years and under many aliases. There was at least one thread on her here at the time of her death.[/QUOTE]
Ok- so can someone please tell me “Tee’s” real name and/or her alias? She’s apparently deceased so there should be no legal ramifications for outing her now.
[QUOTE=uphill;6970171]
TRUE[/QUOTE]
Um…kinda depends on what the funds/items are, the conditions of the donations, and the rules under which the NFP was incorporated, and why the NFP has ceased to exist. You can’t use “I’m a non-profit, nyah!” to dodge legitimate debt. If assets have to be sold to pay legitimate creditors OF THE ORGANIZATION (ie the NFP-as-corporate-entity owes the landlord, the power company, etc–NOT the director’s personal house is in forclosure) the court can order that, or unless there were specific written instructions on a particular gift, the organization can sell assets to pay for it. If their charter allows it, a disbanding museum, for example, could auction off the art to the public. If there were restrictions on the gift, they have to abide by those, or go to court to get them overturned. (There have been, again, art museum who had to do this just to build a new building because collections were given with the stipulation they be displayed in X location forever…most museums will now just refuse gifts or bequests like that as they aren’t worth future hassle.)
And, of course, the IRS can seize just about anything if it turns out the corporate entity owes taxes.
[QUOTE=Liberty;6970246]
Celeita Kramer / Crossed Sabers / SWAP has been “a month away” of “losing the farm” for YEARS. I’m guessing it’s been a somewhat successful marketing ploy since she’s still using it.
I can only hope that with the Feds shining the spotlight on AC4H, they also shine it in the direction of Celeita Kramer. From what I’ve read and heard, AC4H and SWAP appear to me to be two of the biggest “horse adoption/rescue” scams on the East Coast.[/QUOTE]
SOOOO TRUE!! Celeita has been using this ‘losing the farm’ ploy for at least 10 years. She has had fundraisers to save the farm MANY times. She even had “her fiance Ed” ( ex with much drama played out on the Internet) pay off the second mortgage ( around $150K as I recall) and somehow her lawyer FORGOT to sign the promised paperwork giving him a second mortgage. Perhaps this time it’s true!!
Somewhere there must be archived SWAP webpages giving info…or Icequeen ( former trainer at SWAP) would know. Bet he was there about the time she was. Icequeen…where are you?? I just remember adopter being VERY unhappy.
AC4H will continue …at least for now.
[QUOTE=Calamber;6970503]
Right, desperation for money with poor ethical standards will get you every time. Christy wanted to save her farm, and found a way to do it…[/QUOTE]
Save WHAT farm? Christy doesn’t own a farm; they own a doublewide on about an acre and a half of land. There’s a large garage separate down by the road and they have a lean-to shelter in the back for one horse. That’s it. They RENT an old bank barn in N. Hiedelberg Township that has an acre+ dry lot attached to it for what rescues they have. They house their minis and a few horses across the street from her home at her parent’s, where they converted a small garage for the horses and fenced off a tiny paddock. That’s it, folks, as far as the actual rescue goes.
[QUOTE=Miss Aria;6970594]
Save WHAT farm? Christy doesn’t own a farm; they own a doublewide on about an acre and a half of land. There’s a large garage separate down by the road and they have a lean-to shelter in the back for one horse. That’s it. They RENT an old bank barn in N. Hiedelberg Township that has an acre+ dry lot attached to it for what rescues they have. They house their minis and a few horses across the street from her home at her parent’s, where they converted a small garage for the horses and fenced off a tiny paddock. That’s it, folks, as far as the actual rescue goes.[/QUOTE]
They are talking about Crossed Sabers not AC4H
Oh, sorry, my bad. Just assumed since it was an AC4H thread they were talking about AC4H.:winkgrin:
[QUOTE=Calamber;6970503]
The handwriting is on the wall, it all revolves around the decay of the agricultural, scientific and industrial decay of this nation over the last 40 + years since the death of John and Robert Kennedy, I should say, their assassination and the subsequent coverup.[/QUOTE]
That is so where I was expecting you to go…
