Guide to all things Pony? - and, meet Grundy

[endlessclimb]

She’s a 3 year old who is minimally handled, who has been here less than a month. I like her sass. She just cant be kicking my Old Man horse for no reason - full stop.

Her being tied for 3 hours is no different than at a show or at a trail head. It’s good for horses to learn patience. Better to practice at home. I was just doing barn chores and tidying up while she was tied.

She’s been let loose, fear not. The Old Man is in a stall for the night so he can have some peace without her kicking at him for just existing.

[endlessclimb]

For the record, I have cameras everywhere. I can see her thumping on him. He’s trying to get away from her and she backs up and keeps kicking. He’s 26 and has a bum leg. He’s can’t move like he used to.

[OnAMission]

I know horses. I don’t make horses be what I want when I know they aren’t able. You’ve put your gelding in a bad spot. I’m glad you have them separate. I don’t like the combative tone you have with her and I suspect she doesn’t like it either. She’s only 3 and from a janky background and you’re expecting perfection and driving it. She is still a sentient creature that you’re throttling on. I have no doubt she’s thumping on him; she’s not BAD, she’s trying to survive in a brand new high pressure situation. I am not hearing any give/take/understanding for her, she’s immediately a villian in the situation and that sucks for her. I think you’re being hard on her. Maybe trying that on will help you do better with her bc it kind of seems like things are devolving.

[endlessclimb]

Actually if you’ve read the thread she’s doing great, outside of this one issue. She reliably loads, we go to new places, she’s doing new things when asked.

The Old Man has precedence over any other horse here. If she keeps beating up on him, she will certainly find her way to a new home. The rest of her is exactly my style and she’s progressing well, but that is a deal breaker. Period.

[OnAMission]

I’ve read the entire thread since start and I agree, that old man is the most important thing. don’t give her any more chances to keep beating up on him, no matter why she is doing it. I’m not totally sure YOU are HER style but time will tell.

[endlessclimb]

That’s fair, and yes, time will tell indeed.

[SusanO]

Years ago when I was in a Co-op situation with another horse owner, she invited an acquaintance to bring her horse to join the herd. The mare was a 3 year old QH mare and she was a be-otch. That mare would run across the pasture backwards to nail a horse kicking all the way. My friend did not want that mare out with her mare. Well - you invited her. I don’t want that horse out with my horses either.

The girl that had the mare was not the owner, her father was. She wasn’t taking care of the horse and one day Daddy came to check on things and saw the filthy stall she was in…Horse left the next day and the problem was solved. That horse had never been in a bad situation and she was not going to get any better anytime soon as far as I could tell. Did not want the vet bill to see if she was going to get more friendly. Sometimes they will pick on a horse if they think it is vulnerable. Just herd behavior. But not in my herd.

[endlessclimb]

I do think some of it can be a more mareish-mare. The supplements are worth a shot with Ms. Grundy, as is regumate. If she can’t learn to get along, she will have to find somewhere else to live - I’m not set up here for permanent separation and if she’s going to do it in a 2 acre pasture, there’s no living arrangement that will work with them together.

Niko has always been the lead, but I recognize he’s getting older and will lose that post. He held it with Shayney, but she never challenged him.

From what I can see on videos, he’s willingly given up his post as King, but Grundy won’t be fair at this time. We will proceed with an attempt at supplements, then regumate if that doesn’t work. I’ll continue to do stuff with her in the meantime, including teaching her to stand tied quietly.

There’s a show this weekend I’m going to bring her to, to just look around and eat grass and take it all in.

[endlessclimb]

So I gave some serious thought to @OnAMission 's comments regarding me being confrontational.

I haven’t had ANY confrontations with this young mare outside of when she’s turned her butt to me (pasture halter throw, and for grain one morning - two instances) or tried to snipe in a bite (wanted to eat on the trail walk, pinned ears and snapped teeth when told “not yet”).

The reason she got moved around in the dry lot yesterday is 1) it’s the only soft footing, everything else is concrete and 2) I didn’t want to have a line on her - I wanted her to be able to MOVE when asked and I don’t have anywhere else small and fenced. Outside of yesterday her weekday work is a 15 minute or less lunge, working on strength and voice cues, which she’s picking up quickly. She hasn’t been ridden at my property yet because I have pretty stringent pre-flight checks that she isn’t passing at the moment. It’s mostly her facial expression that shows she isn’t ready.

I like young horses. I have had lots of them, trained lots of them. I love watching them learn. I love seeing the progress. I clearly like this young mare or I wouldn’t even be attempting to make this work. I also enjoy gritty mares, I’ve owned several. This mare is progressing quickly on everything, learns fast, is a little flightier to start than I’d like but it’s improving every day. I don’t believe in giving much thought to “oh but she came from an abusive situation” because the reality is we are in TODAY not yesterday - former trauma may provide obstacles, but it’s not an excuse to give up. You see this excuse in dog owners all the time.

But the bottom line is, I’m not set up for long term solo anything, and if double barrel kicking when there’s no reason to (one example, my Old Man is nowhere near anything to guard, just walking along the side of the barn, and she went after him) is her go-to, there’s an issue. If there’s a horse that deserves to enjoy the fruits of my labor, it’s my Old Man (who I also bought when he was 3, and is 26 now).

All that said, my communication style must indicate that I am constantly at war with my horses, which couldn’t be farther from the truth. With that, I think I’ll just post pictures here.

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it.

[Syrynx]

I have been enjoying the Grundy stories and I do hope she settles and leaves your good Old Man alone.

[trubandloki]

This type of horse is exactly what people like me were referring to in your thread and other threads where people ask about group stall living.

I hope she changes her ways, but if she is like the mare I own, that is not likely to happen.

Fingers crossed for you.

[endlessclimb]

I hope she does too because otherwise she’s been a fun little project. Maybe this is what she’s like when she’s in transitional heats? I’ve been lucky with my mares - none have had brutal heats. Shayney maybe the worst, being spookier during but not unmanageable.

[trubandloki]

@endlessclimb

I hope she does too because otherwise she’s been a fun little project. Maybe this is what she’s like when she’s in transitional heats? I’ve been lucky with my mares - none have had brutal heats. Shayney maybe the worst, being spookier during but not unmanageable.

The mare I am talking about is like this all the time.

[endlessclimb]

My only hope is that she wasn’t like this to start with, and it’s really flared up in the last week. I’ll try what I can, supplements and regumate, but I’m realistic as to what this means if that doesn’t help. I can even deal with “stalling” the Old Man overnight if that gives them a little space. But I can’t separate them 24/7. I’m just not set up for it.

[beowulf]

Interim adjustment period - inexperienced and young horses start to prod at the established status quo once they’re settled in and feeling comfortable. Putting them in a large group can help, but I understand there are a thousand reasons this isn’t always possible. Our old man (also on mega-tenure ) is not out with our mare anymore either after she kicked him hard in the cannon bone and caused injury. After that she lived in her own pen with goats, now she has a mini that she’s much gentler with. I have been putting her with Holden out on grass in the summer, and that’s humbled her, but some horses are what they are.

[Obsidian_Fire]

@endlessclimb keep posting how things are going. I happen to appreciate the no-nonsense style you have. It makes for solid citizens.
Nobody here, unless they see you personally work your horses, can really say if you “go too far” or whatever.
I think it’s just your writing style, probably your personality style, to be very black and white. Animals appreciate that! They want (and need) to know where they stand.
And truthfully I see far too much of the “oh but I don’t want to hurt him… I want horsey to love me…” crowd and I’m sick of it. I see those horses when they come into my barn for remedial training. It is NOT PRETTY.

[Kinda_Kooky]

I love the Grundy posts and think she is a lucky mare to have you.

You are a very good horse person. Not combative, it just may seem that way to some in story format. And from what I can inference, I would bet you are extremely fair and very good with timing. I also would bet your horses love you and appreciate knowing what they can expect.

If Grundy stays or goes it’s a win win, as long as your gelding is not injured. You are giving her invaluable experiences and training she surely otherwise would not have.

I appreciate your posts and honestly, it’s your sharing of philosophy on horse care (with euth/unsoundness) that have helped shape better parameters for that in my mind.

Lastly, if you were combative the horses would show it. They certainly do not.

[luvmyhackney]

Love the Grundy posts, I’d don’t think you are being tough. Boundaries on a horse not used to them can cause strong reactions.

As long as you’re fair, she will be fine.

I have an older lifer pony and he is always first. My lease horse was being a butt to him, so I just alternated turnouts and then sat out with a lunge whip. Every time he threatened my pony he got to work. After about 2 days, he chilled out and got the hint.

Younger horses sense weakness and act on it.

[PamnReba]

I adopted a mare last fall and really tried to make it work, but recently sent her back to the rescue I got her from. She was hard to like anyway (very standoffish and unfriendly), but then this summer she started beating up my other mare for no discernable reason (bite marks on her ass, mostly), and constantly kept her and my gelding moving moving moving across all 14 acres - she wouldn’t settle and graze in place for long, and so of course it kept the other two agitated as well.

Now that she is gone, peace and tranquility has returned once again. I didn’t realize how high the energy level was with her in the mix, until she left and it came back down again. Some horses just don’t work, no matter how hard you try or how long they stay.

ETA - I like the Grundy updates as well, don’t think you’re too hard on her, but curious minds have to ask - will she walk through the curtain??

[endlessclimb]

She already is.