La Mundial: Horrible Customer Service - refusing to make boots UPDATE post 138

LM did not subcontract to Fabrica, LM took them on as a partner, and Fabrica did not pay, then Fabrica continued to sell boots “by LM” while pocketing the money and launching a new brand. Those boots Fabrica would have shipped would have carried the new brand name, which is just bad business in my book. But, they are apparently no longer operating. So, LM is taking Fabrica to court to straighten out those orders along with their own non-payment. Even though those orders were apparently fraudulently taken by another party, LM intends to stand behind them because their name was taken in vain, so to speak.

Regarding not getting back to people, Roberto is trying to do all of this himself. It’s a little tough. Not cool, I agree, and I will reiterate to him that he needs to get some more quality help to be sure his lines of communication are fast, accurate, and caring, with each customer.

I’m just a private citizen like the rest of you. I have a soft spot for legacy family-owned brands, so I’m reporting the positive side of things as I’ve been able to piece them together. Whether I turn out to be right… future history will tell.

[QUOTE=Horseflyer;7793941]
Even though those orders were apparently fraudulently taken by another party, LM intends to stand behind them because their name was taken in vain, so to speak.[/QUOTE]

My understanding is that Fabrica took partial ownership of La Munidal. So that’s something very different. La Mundial is standing behind the orders because they were taken by the company, albeit by a different segment of the compant’s owners?!

I happen to have my contract here in my office and was going over it carefully, and could find no mention of Fabrica.

Until I read the fine print on the back of the order form. The “Terms and Conditions” are there, and La Mundial is at the top of the page, and it states payment is to be made to “Fabrica (also known as La Mundial).” All the paperwork clearly indicates that La Mundial and Fabrica are the same company. There is nothing that would notify a purchaser that they were dealing with a different entity than La Mundial – even the payment line explicitly states that they are the same company.

Therefore, LM isn’t necessarily volunteering to make the boots as promised by Fabrica, the paperwork told consumers they were one and the same.

It goes on to state that there will be no refunds, but that the boots will be made to order. In other words, they are saying they will be made to match the measurements on the paper, not necessarily to your satisfaction.

It does say that any disputes will be litigated completely in the State of Florida, so that makes any potential lawsuit somewhat easier. You still can’t get money back if there is no one in the U.S. to satisfy a judgment.

Based on the terms of the contract though, it would be hard to litigate for a refund under any circumstances, as they are very clear that they will not refund money at all, ever. But, I also read the contract to indicate that they would be held responsible to get the boots to match the ordered measurements.

For complete disclosure, I ordered mine at Red Hills in March, and they were delivered in June and are totally wonderful. I did not do any research prior to ordering (which is totally unlike me, but at the start of the event, I was determined NOT to order any). When I came here and did some searching afterward, I was horrified by the bad stories and worried and worried until my boots arrived, right on schedule.

I do think it is interesting that the terms of sale/contract is intended to be initialed and signed by both parties, and I was not asked to do that. But, they would be able to make an argument that by handing over payment, a purchaser had accepted the terms.

I am keeping my fingers crossed that you get some satisfaction and I am so sorry that you’ve had to go through this. I am hoping that Roberto makes good on what he has told Holly.

I’ll keep watching this space. It is unfortunate that this is the type of business practice that garners so much bad press for a company – with so many people unhappy, I am surprised that there aren’t folks with signs picketing the booth at Congress . . .

Bensmom, glad you had a good experience. Near as I can tell, I believe we’re talking about a fairly small (but understandably) vocal group that got caught in the crossfire when Fabrica and LaMundial split up. Perhaps it’s better to say… the Rivas family owners did not receive the funds, and the Fabrica owners, after they had left the partnership, used paperwork with the LM name on it. The Rivas family (Roberto et al) is claiming they will stand behind their family brand name, La Mundial, regardless of all of the above. It’s just going to take more time with that small minority caught in the crossfire.

At least this is what I understand will happen! :slight_smile:

It sucks to have ordered boots, paid for them, and not have them. Just purely frustrating for everyone in that situation.

[QUOTE=Horseflyer;7794297]
Bensmom, glad you had a good experience. Near as I can tell, I believe we’re talking about a fairly small (but understandably) vocal group that got caught in the crossfire when Fabrica and LaMundial split up. Perhaps it’s better to say… the Rivas family owners did not receive the funds, and the Fabrica owners, after they had left the partnership, used paperwork with the LM name on it. The Rivas family (Roberto et al) is claiming they will stand behind their family brand name, La Mundial, regardless of all of the above. It’s just going to take more time with that small minority caught in the crossfire.

At least this is what I understand will happen! :slight_smile:

It sucks to have ordered boots, paid for them, and not have them. Just purely frustrating for everyone in that situation.[/QUOTE]

So you think that someone from Fabrica set up a booth at horse shows with the La Mundial banners and intentionally took orders just to mess with La Mundial?

Again, maybe I have read the “small but vocal group” wrong but I think more than one ordered at a horse show.

If the group is small (as you are saying) then it seems like a quick and easy problem for LM to fix and the OP should not be left hanging out to dry, still.

[QUOTE=trubandloki;7794333]
So you think that someone from Fabrica set up a booth at horse shows with the La Mundial banners and intentionally took orders just to mess with La Mundial?[/QUOTE]

Yes, that’s exactly what happened.

Small group… well, it’s large enough to take some time. All I meant it that it’s not large enough for a picket line at Congress.

Look, I do customer service somewhat for a living, in that I am a trusted advisor to many brands, including all facets of their marketing and CRM. So bear with me through the two following viewpoints…

As a fellow horse person and someone who has a soft spot for this brand, I would say, please remember that the Rivas family was left without the promised funds, so they are the victim of Fabrica here as well. They are trying to fix it with the small team they have. They hope very much everyone will be able to forgive the LM name after they make it right for everyone.

As a professional (noted above), no customer wants to hear a damn thing about the problems of a company who has wronged them. They just want it fixed, and now.

So, for anyone who has a deeper well of patience to draw upon, and a soft spot for a very old handcrafted brand (we’re losing those, btw), perhaps tap that well. But, if you are of the second viewpoint, I completely understand as well.

[QUOTE=Horseflyer;7794392]

As a fellow horse person and someone who has a soft spot for this brand, I would say, please remember that the Rivas family was left without the promised funds, so they are the victim of Fabrica here as well. They are trying to fix it with the small team they have. They hope very much everyone will be able to forgive the LM name after they make it right for everyone.

As a professional (noted above), no customer wants to hear a damn thing about the problems of a company who has wronged them. They just want it fixed, and now.

So, for anyone who has a deeper well of patience to draw upon, and a soft spot for a very old handcrafted brand (we’re losing those, btw), perhaps tap that well. But, if you are of the second viewpoint, I completely understand as well.[/QUOTE]

This isn’t a small amount of money. Those who ordered boots probably paid close to $1000 or more. They are out that money. In the meantime, they may need to order different boots because no one is communicating to them when or IF they’ll ever receive their boots.

I work in customer service too, but telling people they won’t be getting their boots OR their money and then not returning emails? I don’t care how small the operation is- if you have the man power to be at Congress/various other horse shows, you have the man power to answer emails.

Good point Gorgonzola! I will convey the displeasure when I next hear from Roberto.

As unfortunate as the situation seems to be (let’s not forget that we don’t really know the extent of the legalities between Fabrica and La Mundial - it’s all hearsay, and we’re only getting one side of the story) it’s not the customer’s problem. Period.

There is a certain amount of risk involved when running a business, and even more so when distributing your assets. They very may be in a bad situation, but that should have been assessed before any potential acquisition. And even if Fabrica was vetted with flying colours, the risk is still there, and ought to be accepted by La Mundial, not the poor fools* who ordered the boots.

At the end of the day, if La Mundial has the resources to take new orders and subsequently produce product for those orders, they should be doing the same for ALL of the wronged parties. Yes, this means they will be taking a financial hit in the mean time, but it is on THEM to suss that out in court and attempt to recover their losses. Expecting customers who paid for a product to wait for them to try and sort out their legal matters is downright asinine.

I’ll keep an eye on this thread. For me, it’s not the ordeal itself that makes me want to permanently steer clear of the company… it’s how they’re handling it.

[QUOTE=OnlyByNight;7794646]
Expecting customers who paid for a product to wait for them to try and sort out their legal matters is downright asinine. [/QUOTE]

It IS downright asinine… I couldn’t agree more. However, I am hearing from Roberto that it is a required step that they go to court and get a judgment before taking those orders over from Fabrica and making the boots. Not being an attorney at all, let alone one licensed to practice in Ecuador, I don’t feel I’m in a position to question his attorney’s judgement in that matter. (Also, I stand in general awe at how asinine many laws can be.)

I completely agree that the ordeal is not what should be judged, it’s how they handle it. That’s a super attitude to take. :slight_smile:

However… give it a little more time… and perhaps it will all work out fine in the end. FWIW, I’m here to help straighten things out, at Roberto’s request.

[QUOTE=Horseflyer;7794751]
It IS downright asinine… I couldn’t agree more. However, I am hearing from Roberto that it is a required step that they go to court and get a judgment before taking those orders over from Fabrica and making the boots.[/QUOTE]
I am not even close to being a lawyer and I have not stayed at a Holiday Inn Express or any other hotel in eons but I doubt they have been told not to make the boots for the customers but that by making the boots for the customers it might show that they have been responsible for it all along, which are hugely different and in the grand scheme of things continues to only make them look bad. Very bad.

To me it is disgusting to leave these clients hanging. We are not talking about a $20 item. Maybe an expensive pair of custom boots are pocket change to some people but I am guessing that is not the case for all of these people.

[QUOTE=Horseflyer;7794751]
However… give it a little more time… and perhaps it will all work out fine in the end. FWIW, I’m here to help straighten things out, at Roberto’s request.[/QUOTE]
This has been clear since the beginning, I assume he is paying you to be his spokesman (since it appears that is your job) and appease people while he screws them over.

As an update on my side I did forward my information and missed a call from Roberto last night unfortunately. I will be attempting to get in touch with him again today/ hopeful that he will reach out to me as their phone situation is a little tricky to deal with.

Currently I am feeling much more optimistic. As others have said I am not so much outraged by the situation as I am by how disturbingly it has been handled until this point. I won’t discuss that in any more detail and I am going my best to be patient and optimistic. It would have been much easier for me to initially take pity or see the “damaged company” side if the company’s face or voice by way of customer service hadn’t been so rude or lacking in communication in addition to repeatedly changing their story and then denying previous version. Obviously in total LM is most financially damaged but in terms of the financial impact on each person we are all damaged and there is definitely a disservice being done to the clients out boots in this situation. Until they take care of current clients that damage will remain and might continue to grow.

The fact that it took me making a public stink to get a response of any kind is unfortunate. It’s not my life mission to talk about negative experiences on public forums to cause unfavorable opinion to companies but as I suspected the attention this thread got did me some good of sorts and got the company’s attention in the way my multiple emails and repeated calls didn’t.

I will certainly update if I get any more news. Fingers crossed it will be positive and I have boots sometime this year… Which is slowly dwindling away.

Dear Trubandloki,

Nope, not being paid. The only skin in the game I have is that if they right this ship, Horsefly will hopefully retain them as a client next year. If they don’t right their ship, we want nothing to do with them.

The fact that I am laying my spotless reputation for honesty and good business practice out here on their behalf speaks volumes to the people who know me. It tells my colleagues and friends that I think the LM heart is good, while their resources are low. Am I wrong? Maybe. I always tend to see the best in people, but as I’ve mentioned a few times on this thread, I have developed a pretty good radar for cheaters, liars and thieves. I’m out here laying MY reputation on the line that Roberto is nowhere close to any of those things, in contrast to what you suggest.

Best case, I help get people their boots and aid Roberto in those efforts. Worst case, I can hold my head high that at least I tried to help, rather than lighting a pyre to burn a 116 year old family business.

I think anyone who has $800 hanging out there for custom boots has every right to be angry, and if they’re not hearing enough from LM, they can email me directly with all the details, and I will forward to Roberto. Everyone else, I’m not sure the flaming is all that necessary or helpful.

Most sincerely,
Holly Davis
holly@horseflygroup.com

It blows my mind that LM would be worrying about advertising when they have other issues to be focused on?!

We do a lot more than advertising.

Okay. It blows my mind that LM would be focused on anything other than the litigation and making the situation right for ripped off customers!

I said “next year”… if they don’t have everything resolved far sooner, then naturally there will be no advertising.

BTW, advertising is not inherently evil. At its best, it is open communication between a company and its customers. What I’m doing here is even considered part of marketing, is it not?

To be sure, many marketing people (and manufacturers, and sales people) don’t care if the products they represent are good. I have been in confidential high-level meetings that WOULD blow your mind, where companies told me point-blank they sell crap to cheap people who don’t understand or want to pay for quality. One of these was a trailer manufacturer, and one was a joint supplement. Yippee. Until your horse goes permanently lame, you can cart them around in a paper bag at 70 mph. For the record, I did not pursue nor work one minute for those clients and others like them.

I like to sleep at night. I like to believe wholeheartedly in my clients and their products. I like to use my powers for good, not evil.

They told me when I entered ad school at UT Austin some nearly 30 years ago that I would be reviled right up there with attorneys and used car salesmen. Well, I behave honestly and hope that I can be a good example for the profession I love.

I’m not criticizing YOU Horseflyer. I’m criticizing LM. It should not take getting blasted on a bulletin board/social media for them to make their customers whole. And they should not be having you as a volunteer mouthpiece. This is important, they need to TAKE CARE OF THIS THEMSELVES AND IMMEDIATELY. The fact that they’d ask you to run interference/answer for them and then length this has dragged on speaks to me about the seriousness with which they’re addressing the situation. You don’t see Vogel or Dehner or CWD or Smartpak any other company having random internet strangers answer for them. They handle it themselves and they handle it PRIVATELY.

It should not take getting blasted on a bulletin board/social media for them to make their customers whole. And they should not be having you as a volunteer mouthpiece. This is important, they need to TAKE CARE OF THIS THEMSELVES AND IMMEDIATELY.

Horseflyer… I own a marketing and branding company. We also handle all facets of advertising, design, and PR. Basically, I do most of the things that your company does, but my clients are not primarily equine-based.

I have to say that I agree with VXF above. Whatever soft spot you may have for an ancient family business goes out the window and straight to hell when you’re out a grand and the company won’t communicate with you. Even a statement on their website, or a company Facebook page, or ANYTHING direct from the company would be better than a random PR company posting on COTH.

Make that a random PR company that appears to be speaking unofficially on behalf of a company without actually being hired by them.

Honestly, this just doesn’t make a lot of sense.

I have to wonder if all this doesn’t come down to one very practical matter. LM doesn’t know who paid for the boots and doesn’t have the information on their measurements.

It’s all well and good to say that LM should be producing boots for every person who contacts them and says they paid F for boots. But how do they know for sure? Has F handed over all the invoices?

If they are just going to produce a pair of custom boots for everyone who tells them they’ve paid for them, I’ve got an email to send to LM.