Mb civil suit rulings 11/15/2022

[MHM]

@trubandloki

@MHM

So it certainly sounded like she was keeping track of the comings and goings up the driveway.

Between naps?

And “reading” on the porch.

Maybe that’s why RG had the cameras set up to alert his phone to any activity.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@DownYonder

@CurrentlyHorseless

At the same time, when you listen to the calls, you get the impression of an alpha male aggressively “taking charge” of his life.

“Alpha male.” It’s very interesting that we have heard that term before being used to describe MB.

LOL. Someone else has described MB as an alpha male.

LOL.

[MHM]

@Warmblood1

@3PonyFarm

Does the command center also have a situation room that @eggbutt and other insiders can work out of?

Oh, yes. EB sits in her own room at a very large and intimidating desk. She has a collection of dressage whips on the wall to discipline anyone in the mob who doesn’t immediately follow blind orders.

There might also be a lunge whip involved for group discipline.

[3PonyFarm]

She could crack it like Colbert did.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@trubandloki

@CurrentlyHorseless

I think it’s naive and wrong to assume or think that his mental breakdown is attributable to LKs actions.

Then how do you explain the prosecution’s witness who explained that Michael was not insane because his fears were based on reality, that Lauren was truly doing the things that Michael thought she was doing?

I’ve said I agree with the jury’s verdict that he was not criminally responsible for having shot her due to insanity. Like the jury, I am rejecting the view of the prosecutions witness that MB was not insane.

I do not believe that MB was both sane and insane at the same time.

[trubandloki]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Omgitsme

You know, I’ve agreed with some of your posts in the past but this particular narrative is getting absurd. Do you know what their “insane” response to the document was? No. We know she refused to sign what she claims was (essentially) a license to kill her. Ridiculous.
LK posted threatening and disparaging remarks on Facebook about him. Says she’s not in control of her multiple personalities. Who wouldn’t call the police about that? I’m a “sane” person and an introvert and if I felt the police weren’t providing me any support I would 100% go into the station and ask for help. I would be angry that I was being ignored because my (for lack of a better word) abuser was a tiny woman.

Another poster, @BigMama1, asserted that the 911 call was not about their declining to sign the document (as MB stated to the 911 operator) but rather about their “insane” reaction to the request that they sign the document. I was following up on her comment, asking what the “insane reaction” was, other then declining to sign.

I believe people have the right to decline to sign documents, and I think it is bizarre, and perhaps illustrative of delusional behavior, to call 911 and expect the police to force someone to sign a document.

Has the actual document at issue ever been disclosed? People seem to assume it was a liability release, but I’ve never seen a definitive description of the document.

I can’t remember, did you watch the trial (or the online recordings of it)? It seems like you missed part of it, or forgot part.
Ruth Cox testified where she describes the documents given by MB’s attorney, and RG’s reaction where he started threatening her, inspiring MB to call 911.

I mean, your imaginary movie in your head is more fun, but you might as well go with the facts on this one.

[erinmeri]

@CurrentlyHorseless

For you, yes, but not for me.

To bring this to the issue of the topic of the thread, are you hoping or predicting that Deininger and Bilinkas will attempt to show that LK was the proximate cause of her own injuries because she caused his mental breakdown, and it was his mental breakdown that caused her to be shot?

I don’t think they will even attempt such a thing.

Have you not read MB’s response and counter claim? https://forum.chronofhorse.com/uploads/short-url/iPgsjC6AFaqzB1YLBbez2sATW7Y.pdf

Specifically:

[MHM]

@trubandloki

I mean, your imaginary movie in your head is more fun, but you might as well go with the facts on this one.

Why start now?

[Sdel]

@CurrentlyHorseless

I’ve said I agree with the jury’s verdict that he was not criminally responsible for having shot her due to insanity. Like the jury, I am rejecting the view of the prosecutions witness that MB was not insane.

Interesting disconnect. The only other testimony related to his insanity directly credited his condition and actions to the fear that was a direct result of LK’s behavior and actions. Nothing else.

The prosecution did not make the case for Michael to have diminished mental state, they cited motive.

[Angela_Freda]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Has the actual document at issue ever been disclosed? People seem to assume it was a liability release, but I’ve never seen a definitive description of the document.

What else could it be though?
She was seeking to have someone come on to the property to ride her horses, so… I mean, a waiver isn’t a leap.

Considering her penchant for avoiding being served… Her avoiding this benign, common waiver we’ve all signed… Its pretty telling that she flips the script on this to make it seem so ridiculously nefarious.

[MorganSercu]

@Knights_Mom

This is exactly their claim.

Have you not noticed this?

snorts

[Sdel]

@Angela_Freda

She was seeking to have someone come on to the property to ride her horses, so… I mean, a waiver isn’t a leap.

It was apparently displayed on the barn wall and she showed it and acknowledged what it said to the police….but wouldn’t sign it and the police agreed she couldn’t sign off on her own murder. The language she used makes it clear it was a liability waiver. Plus she said she dropped things to the police as a hypothetical so when MB was subpoenaed and on trial she could prove perjury.

[MorganSercu]

You’re a pony? Ponies and stubborny are one and the same.

[cutter99]

@BigMama1

@cutter99

Here’s the thing- if they wanted to keep the Suboxone boxes hidden, they would have.

How difficult would it be???

You collapsed the box, put it inside a bag with other garbage, throw it in the can and no one is the wiser.

Either very sloppy or didn’t care who knew.

Was it supposed to be a secret? I don’t see why it would. I can see keeping active drug use on the downlow but this is a drug that treats addiction, no? And in theory keeps people from using. (We know that wasn’t exactly working for RG)

Not saying it should have been a secret at all, but it sounds like the other occupants of the farm had no idea they were sharing a living space with people with addiction issues.

Unless either LK or RG had shared their addiction issues with those living there, I can see it would be somewhat shocking to them.

And then the questions start. What are they addicted to? Is it an active addiction? Are they using illegal drugs? What does this mean for my safety? The safety of my family? My business?

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@erinmeri

@CurrentlyHorseless

For you, yes, but not for me.

To bring this to the issue of the topic of the thread, are you hoping or predicting that Deininger and Bilinkas will attempt to show that LK was the proximate cause of her own injuries because she caused his mental breakdown, and it was his mental breakdown that caused her to be shot?

I don’t think they will even attempt such a thing.

Have you not read MB’s response and counter claim? https://forum.chronofhorse.com/uploads/short-url/iPgsjC6AFaqzB1YLBbez2sATW7Y.pdf

Specifically:

Does point 36 claim LK “caused” MBs fragile mental state, or that she should have known that his mental state was fragile?

It says the latter.

I’ve been pointing out that MB was displaying behavior that should have alerted all those around him, especially those closest to him like MHG, that he was suffering a mental breakdown.

Yes, LK should have seen red flags. Nagel will make the same point I just made: if MHG, RC, and Tarshis did not recognize in real time the extent of MBs mental breakdown, why should LK be expected to recognize it? Apparently his mental breakdown is not obvious to everyone even in hindsight, as the prosecution expert testified that he was sane.

Of course the defense will attempt to say that LK should have acted differently by recognizing MB was delusional to mitigate her damages. If she had understood the extent of the delusions, she probably would have acted differently.

[DownYonder]

I am struck by the fact that a certain poster on this thread readily acknowledges that MB had a mental breakdown, yet cannot grasp why jurors may have wanted to ensure that he receive psychiatric help before he was released into their community. I can’t figure out if said poster is being willfully stubborn or willfully obtuse.

[Sdel]

@CurrentlyHorseless

Yes, LK should have seen red flags. Nagel will make the same point I just made: if MHG, RC, and Tarshis did not recognize in real time the extent of MBs mental breakdown, why should LK be expected to recognize it? Apparently his mental breakdown is not obvious to everyone even in hindsight, as the prosecution expert
testified that he was sane.

I think the relevant evidence will be the email/text exchange where it is acknowledged that the plan was working and that MB was scared. That was the point where she had the duty to stop.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Angela_Freda

@CurrentlyHorseless

Has the actual document at issue ever been disclosed? People seem to assume it was a liability release, but I’ve never seen a definitive description of the document.

What else could it be though?
She was seeking to have someone come on to the property to ride her horses, so… I mean, a waiver isn’t a leap.

Considering her penchant for avoiding being served… Her avoiding this benign, common waiver we’ve all signed… Its pretty telling that she flips the script on this to make it seem so ridiculously nefarious.

If it was a waiver for injury to the other people riding her horses, they would need to sign, not LK.

[Sdel]

@DownYonder

I am struck by the fact that a certain poster on this thread readily acknowledges that MB had a mental breakdown, yet cannot grasp why jurors may have wanted to ensure that he receive psychiatric help before he was released into their community. I can’t figure out if said poster is being willfully stubborn or willfully obtuse.

Desperately trying to figure out how they are still on the winning side is an option as well.

[ekat]

@erinmeri

Have you not read MB’s response and counter claim

Or, his second defense, which speaks for itself:

The whole thing, all 24 pages is well worth a read for anyone interested.