MB Civil Trial: JK/KK Contempt of Court?

[ekat]

@KurPlexed

New bear picture and update posted.

I love the bear. A lot.

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@Warmblood1

@CurrentlyHorseless

If you have “absolutely nothing” to base your “understanding” on, why bequeath your “absolutely baseless” “understanding” to us?

If the initial intake evaluation or the thirty day evaluation indicated that he would benefit from psychiatric drugs, anxiety medication, antidepressants, or blood pressure medication, whatever, do you think that he would be denied those medications just because his Krol hearing has not occurred yet? How many men approaching 60 in the general population are on “zero medications”?

I agree with you that normal clothes, better food, visits from loved ones and the letters of support are some of the best “medicine” there is. But why would a psychiatric facility withhold important medications just because the Krol hearing has been delayed for months?

As opposed to you “bequeathing” your “absolutely baseless understandings” on us? How many times have you drug out threads only for your “baseless” statements to be proven wrong?

You’re even making baseless assumptions about his medication in your very next paragraph.

Come on. Pot meet kettle.

I never claimed to know or “understand” what medications MB is on.

I said that I’d be shocked if a licensed psychiatric facility did not put him on whatever medications were indicated by the various assessments. I think that’s unlikely to be “zero” as most men approaching 60 are on some medications, because MB has a history of depression, and because medications are often the primary way of treating psychiatric conditions.

It’s a conjecture that he’s probably on some medications, and it’s a conjecture based on logic and a general understanding of how medical facilities work.

I’m pretty sure I have no “baseless” statements that have been proven wrong, at least no statements that I advertise as “baseless” when I make them!

[erinmeri]

@ekat

@erinmeri and @trubandloki you guys are too kind. And yes, I am a she.

Personally, I find there are a lot of great minds in these threads. I’ve learned a lot from @lazaret and @FitzE, and @Knights_Mom for example. And I believe it’s @Warmblood1 and @LilRanger who have given us some great insights into institutions like Ann Klein, and processes involved.

Plus, there’s been cool Star Trek trivia. And @DownYonder and the flow charts!
There’s so much great discussion, often about things I’m learning about, and while it’s very personal to Michael Barisone, his family and others involved in the actual proceedings, it’s educational for those of us willing to learn from what happened.
And for everyone who I didn’t tag, who has contributed worthy discussion - I apologize, it’s unintentional.

Hopefully attempts to derail the thread and get it closed will fail so we can keep sharing.

Like I said - there are a lot of fabulous legal eagles! Thanks to all of you, and thanks for clarifying your identity! I really appreciate your patience.

[Sdel]

@CurrentlyHorseless

@Sdel

@Warmblood1

@hut-ho78

@eggbutt

That is a very interesting thought. I’ve also wondered if he can refile against the Police Department, not for rights violations, but blatant incompetence?

Incompetence? Not hardly. Everyone lived.

What a low bar. Hopefully you are never involved in a crime that requires evidence collection, crime scene analysis or police competency beyond “you living.”

I think we need to go back and re-read the police’s brief again. They pretty much argued that the citizenry weren’t entitled to expect the police to do a good job in investigating a crime, or even to investigate it at all, among other things.

No, I think the argument was that nothing the police did, or didn’t do, was a violation of Barisone’s civil rights. The judge agreed and dismissed the case.

It seems to me that it is a travesty that the courts do not consider that the citizenry should need protection from the state….

Just a little snippet to remind everyone the disgusting actions that the courts feel we should just have to “live with”. There are more about how they don’t have to investigate, don’t have to charge people, basically don’t have to do their jobs beyond deciding what narrative they want to frame and fitting the “evidence” to fit if that is what they want to do.

[MHM]

@Knights_Mom

@trubandloki

It is feeling like I need to find another pair of reading glasses to loan out.

Big ones. By the dozen.

This would definitely be the time to buy them at the dollar store, since you would need to get so many of them, and they would probably never be returned.

[Knights_Mom]

@StB.YM

Question for the legal peeps. The subpoenas that were sent to JK and KK were directly addressed to them and were directly served to them. The request for LK’s deposition was sent to Bruce’s firm. The response to push back the contempt hearing came back from Bruce’s firm. Does this mean that when the subpoenas were first served and the contempt motion filed, that JK and KK didn’t have hired counsel and now they do via Bruce’s firm? Or can one party’s lawyers handle a witness’s court rulings on their behalf without contractual employment?

A Notice of Appearance must be filed for each person by an attorney for the Court to recognize that they are represented by counsel. Until that is done, each party must be served themselves either by Personal Service (the best and most binding), Substitute Service, Alternate Service, Nail and Mail, Service to someone in that address of suitable age and discretion, Service by Publication - these are all other types of service though each jurisdiction may differ on rules.

[MHM]

Thank you very, very much for going to the trouble of creating the flow chart. It is extremely helpful!

[CurrentlyHorseless]

@eggbutt

@CurrentlyHorseless

@eggbutt

Remember, you all used to accuse me of having insider information. Remember? I sure do.

I won’t speak for others, but yes, I think you have in the past and likely now receive information from insider(s).

So what?

It was this comment about my “speculation” that prompted my reminder to you:

If you have “absolutely nothing” to base your “understanding” on, why bequeath your “absolutely baseless” “understanding” to us?

Another complete speculation based on common sense only - as mentioned, Michael is allowed in person visits from friends and supporters. Do you not think he might discuss his daily routine with any of them? It IS interesting that, to my knowledge, not a single one of those visitors expressed fear or concern being with Michael. Imagine that.

How about in the future you ignore my posts of speculation, fact, recipes, whatever. Just scroll on by and you’ll be much more relaxed, I promise.

You said it was your “understanding”, based on absolutely nothing, that MB has been on zero medications while at AK.

How can you have an “understanding” about an issue of a factual nature, that is based on “absolutely nothing”?

You have complete control over whether you wish to ignore my posts. Just put me on ignore and you’ll be much more relaxed.

[MHM]

@Maria

I think some need the Hubble telescope

Thanks for the laugh!

[lazaret]

She, as plaintiff, has counsel on record via a notice of appearance, so she can be contacted through her attorneys who are legally her representatives in this matter.

Since JK and KK do not have notice of appearance filed that they are being represented by counsel, laws for service state that they must be served personally (hence why the notice of service contains a physical description of the person served) as they are their own representatives until the court is notified otherwise.

[MHM]

@Sdel

@ekat

@trubandloki

mean, why would they not serve him yet?

See, that’s what I’m thinking. Written discovery was supposed to be complete I think August 2nd. So if they wanted records from him, they would have requested prior to then. Which leads me to believe he gave them stuff. Unless they are just waiting to depose him.

Or he’s run away and is hiding and can’t be found….

Or something else happened to him. Wasn’t it posted on a previous thread that he had told different people to take a hard look at LK‘s actions and alibi if he ever disappeared?

[Sdel]

This seems to suggest they don’t have to investigate at all. Funny, it sure seems they took advantage of this one.

While yes, these may not be “civil rights” violations, it’s pretty much a slap in the face considering the lack of physical evidence presented in the trial and just how much other background evidence they had access to that we have seen glimmers of via the impeachment of LK and RG.

[MHM]

@trubandloki

@lazaret

Legal costs, remember, are being borne by both sides at the moment…

Lauren’s case could be taken on contingency, right? So no out of pocket expenses until they win.

Personally, I would certainly not want to be represented by any lawyer stupid enough to take this case on contingency after observing how the criminal case played out in court.

[DownYonder]

@3PonyFarm

Hackers infiltrated patient records at 2 state psychiatric hospitals

The breach occurred in June.

I hope MB’s records weren’t affected.
Maybe he wasnt there yet-I don’t remember.

Very interesting - and worrisome. And for the record, MB was transferred to Ann Klein on May 13, 2022.

[2tempe]

I work in the investment/securities world. We have attorneys who are well versed in all securities laws, working with clients on how to stay out of regulatory trouble etc. But on the two occasions I (and others) were subpoenaed by the SEC, those lawyers promptly handed us over to litigation attorneys for prep and depositions. Distinctly different types of lawyers, different experience and knowledge.

[MHM]

@trubandloki

The point is, YOU speculate about stuff all the time so why are you acting like anyone else speculating is not allowed?

Maybe only one person per thread is allowed to go by the movies in their head?

[DownYonder]

@ekat

And @DownYonder and the flow charts!

You are welcome! And I also am so grateful for your very patient and clear explanations of legal processes. As well as all the info from the others you mentioned. It has been so very educational!

[ekat]

@MHM

Maybe only one person per thread is allowed to go by the movies in their head?

[iridedressage]

In my job we get served subpoenas every day and if asked before service we always give them our group email address. Then we respond service accepted. Unless it is a subpoena for a specific employee - then they have to serve in person to the employee.

[MHM]

Ok, I’m finally caught up again on the thread. For the moment.

Many thanks to all those who are kind enough to share their actual legal and medical knowledge, rather than the imaginary kind.