[QUOTE=analise;7351619]
Regarding posting videos we like of dressage…
Is this where I get to put in that one of Klimke and Ahlerich in New York? 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXMsopDt3mE[/QUOTE]
This. OMG, this. I never fail to get chills watching Ahlerich (and Matine, of course) and am always amazed at how light he is in the bridle. His poll is always correctly at the highest point and Klimke is so so so soft on the reins. Magic.
[QUOTE=prairiewind2;7351577]
No. This man set out to deceive people by systematically lying about his credentials. That means he is not an innocent who simply overestimates his ability. He is a scammer. Personally, I believe that people who are aware of such deception and remain silent about it are complicit in the deception.
Having said that, some of what has gone on in the thread has not been good, imo. But not any of the stuff that actually involves NP himself - he doesn’t play fair so he can’t expect anyone to play fair with him.
Liz[/QUOTE]
Many people exaggerate, many people tell tall tales, many people tell white lies and bold faced lies. This man has shown offense at what he believes is an attack on himself and his business. That he chooses to respond in an angry way is simply showing his human side. We all have one hidden. He is not stealing candy from babies or savings from retirees.
To err is human, to witch hunt is coth.
And now I ungracefully bow out of this thread.
there are some arenas around here that the sand + the acoustics of the indoor = that shkt, shkt, shkt, sound. I wondered if that was maybe all it was.
He’s a lovely horse and you’ve done well with him.
Best wishes in your journey.
[QUOTE=wildlifer;7351765]
This. OMG, this. I never fail to get chills watching Ahlerich (and Matine, of course) and am always amazed at how light he is in the bridle. His poll is always correctly at the highest point and Klimke is so so so soft on the reins. Magic.[/QUOTE]
And Klimke’s seat is flawless. No ass slapping going on there!
[QUOTE=Gestalt;7351767]
Many people exaggerate, many people tell tall tales, many people tell white lies and bold faced lies. This man has shown offense at what he believes is an attack on himself and his business. That he chooses to respond in an angry way is simply showing his human side. We silk have one hidden. He is not stealing candy from babies or savings from retirees.
To err is human, to witch hunt is coth.
And now I ungracefully bow out of this thread.[/QUOTE]
I’m sorry you’re bowing out, but I want to disagree with you. Professionals in any profession do not exaggerate, tell tall tales, tell white lies or boldface lies. In most professions, that’ll get you fired and drummed out of the profession. That includes the horse profession. Of course this man feels threatened, multiple people have called him out on untruths he has posted on his own website about his credentials, the credentials he uses to solicit money from clients. If he was an AA claiming to “train and show to GP”, or “writing a book to be published by a major horse publishing house” that’s one thing. But he’s using this apparently false information to gain paying clients. That is distinctly another thing. That is taking money from unknowing people under false pretenses. I think we all know the damage “bad” trainers/riders/farriers/shippers/vets/barn owners, etc. can do to a horse and the owners budget diagnosing and making the horse sound again. How is that different from taking savings from retirees? Many dressage riders ARE retirees.
[QUOTE=LeannNelson;7351522]
I just rode one weekend with him…he’s not an aggressive trainer or anything and I am fairly new to dressage I did all the training on Fem but frankly have only been able to afford open shows and schooling shows. I don’t plan to go big with him just plan to keep it fun and keep learning! :)[/QUOTE]
There are probably people in your area that could give you recommendations for some dressage instructors that have legitimate credentials who probably charge about the same amount of money for a lesson. That way you could try out a few and see who best suits your needs.
I understand having limited funds. When I take a lesson or attend a clinic I want to get the best value for my money.
Your horse is lovely and you’ve done a really nice job with him.
And I forgot to add, Leann - your horse is lovely and looks to have quality gaits with a good mind. I would like to see him with a bit longer neck and in a more level balance at his stage of training, but they are minor corrections. I would be happy to see him coming down the center line!
You don’t have to steal from babies or retirees to be stealing nonetheless. Taking money under false pretenses is stealing. I have as much sympathy for newbie, unsuspecting (but hopeful) dressage riders as I do for retirees. And I really, really loathe liars and scammers.
Liz
[QUOTE=Gestalt;7351767]
Many people exaggerate, many people tell tall tales, many people tell white lies and bold faced lies. This man has shown offense at what he believes is an attack on himself and his business. That he chooses to respond in an angry way is simply showing his human side. We all have one hidden. He is not stealing candy from babies or savings from retirees.
To err is human, to witch hunt is coth.
And now I ungracefully bow out of this thread.[/QUOTE]
REALLY?? REALLY?? :eek:
How do you know he is not stealing candy from babies or savings from retirees?
A child may be spending their allowance money to clinic with this dishonest “Grand Prix” trainer.
A “retiree” may be spending some of their savings for this “great opportunity”.
A hardworking parent may be footing the bill for their horse crazy teen to have a chance at riding in a clinic with a “big name” Dressage trainer.
:eek: I can’t believe that anyone would make excuses for a fraud.
Ya, skydy, I feel bad for Leann getting pulled into this but I do NOT feel bad for Nick. He is reaping what he has sown
But, it appears as though his clients are too early in the training to separate the wheat from the chaff. He is not doing anything detrimental that I see, unlike more famous charlatans. The clinic horses appear to be happy, the owners are happy. The gleeful dismantling of this man leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
There are plenty of upper level clinicians I have ridden with who, after the ride, I was hard pressed to come up with something that made paying that 2-300 worthwhile.
Anyone with any knowledge can see through the lack of credentials and, in this case, the level of students he is teaching seems to fit his ability to teach. He could claim that he could train the straightest changes in the history of changes and it wouldn’t matter a bit to his students if they are working the basics. Once they grow in their knowledge, they will realize they are in need of a more accomplished instructor. Until then, I have seen worse trainers.
Would I work with him? No. Do I think he did a disservice to the appy? Probably. I did not see the video. I will cut him some slack because he was a kid.
[QUOTE=skydy;7351806]
:eek: I can’t believe that anyone would make excuses for a fraud.[/QUOTE]
I agree.
And morally, although I don’t advocate self-aggrandizement, there is a difference between someone who exaggerates somewhat, possibly saying that they have “extensive experience schooling horses in classical dressage” or “performed upper level dressage at a young age” versus blatant fabrication like the Dutch training offer and the Dressage Today spiel.
[QUOTE=dotneko;7351841]
But, it appears as though his clients are too early in the training to separate the wheat from the chaff. He is not doing anything detrimental that I see, unlike more famous charlatans. The clinic horses appear to be happy, the owners are happy. The gleeful dismantling of this man leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
There are plenty of upper level clinicians I have ridden with who, after the ride, I was hard pressed to come up with something that made paying that 2-300 worthwhile.
Anyone with any knowledge can see through the lack of credentials and, in this case, the level of students he is teaching seems to fit his ability to teach. He could claim that he could train the straightest changes in the history of changes and it wouldn’t matter a bit to his students if they are working the basics. Once they grow in their knowledge, they will realize they are in need of a more accomplished instructor. Until then, I have seen worse trainers.
Would I work with him? No. Do I think he did a disservice to the appy? Probably. I did not see the video. I will cut him some slack because he was a kid.[/QUOTE]
So it’s OK to lie to beginners because they don’t know the difference?
He’s NOT a kid anymore and he is LYING to potential clients. Yikes…
dotneko, you (nor I) have no idea who all of his clients are - he’s ever-casting that net. You don’t know what he teaches his students save one. Perhaps you should examine the video and pictures of him with his Appy doing GP and Airs before you comment. Are you sure he was only 17 and “a kid” at the time? Do you call that Grand Prix and Haute Ecole? Lastly, do you support fraud in the professional horse world?
[QUOTE=skydy;7351856]
So it’s OK to lie to beginners because they don’t know the difference?
He’s NOT a kid anymore and he is LYING to potential clients. Yikes…[/QUOTE]
Didn’t he originally put the Appaloosa video out there himself as a demonstration of how to teach piaffe?
It’s going to take me a little while to wrap my mind around the thought that it’s OK for the inexperienced to get scammed cuz it really isn’t going to injure them or their horses physically, and they won’t know better anyway.
Liz wanders off pondering this novel outlook on life
Oh, for goodness sakes, he lied about a job offer? And I read that his agent said that PH would be publishing an article - maybe the agent was lying to him. Maybe he does have a book ready to go and again the agent told him it would be a done deal. Your guess is as good as mine.
It’s not as though he has never ridden a horse and just decided to teach. He isn’t throwing them in draw reins or slapping spurs on them He isn’t telling them they need a new saddle, bridle, breeches to fix what ails them. He isn’t telling them to get rid of the horse and ‘hey, I just happen to have the perfect one for you to buy in my barn’.
[QUOTE=Sticky Situation;7351869]
Didn’t he originally put the Appaloosa video out there himself as a demonstration of how to teach piaffe?[/QUOTE]
I don’t think so. I think it was more nostalgic.
Even if I am a Smurf
I’m pretty darned careful who I take lessons with but I would be really really PO’ed if I had somehow signed up for a clinic with NP
[QUOTE=prairiewind2;7351870]
It’s going to take me a little while to wrap my mind around the thought that it’s OK for the inexperienced to get scammed cuz it really isn’t going to injure them or their horses physically, and they won’t know better anyway.
Liz wanders off pondering this novel outlook on life[/QUOTE]
I’m 100% with you and others here because as I mentioned many pages back, I once worked with a scammer and knew another. Both fabricated their "GP credentials. Horses were unhappy and/or lame. Riders were unhappy and sold/bought horses for all the wrong reasons. Lots of money changed hands. Yes,. I eventually learned the truth but only after a lot of money and heartache (and a lot of stress to my horse). As an AA, I’m perturbed at the idea that anyone would think it’s OK for low-level riders to be scammed. As I mentioned before, it’s these same low-level dressage riders that judges and powers-that-be at USDF/USEF always complain about and want to legislate. I can’t believe that anyone affiliated with the USDF thinks this is OK.
By submitting your email, you agree to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy. You may also receive promotional emails from The Chronicle of the Horse. You can opt out at any time.
For Customers
Company
Terms of Use
