Rein-back in Grand Prix

[Badger]

If a lower level rider is only practicing the reinback in and out of the walk in the home arena, I think it’s more than fair for GP riders to point out that they have no appreciation of what is required of a GP horse. A GP horse is ridden to be prepared and available at every single stride to do whatever the rider asks, whether that be to maintain, extend, collect, transition, move in any of a variety of lateral directions, etc. And at an exact letter, not “whenever the rider feels ready.”

The lower level horse in this example reins back then walks forward. Period. That’s all the poster does.

The GP horse reins back a precise number of steps and then may be asked to canter, piaffe, passage, extended trot, stand immobile, collected trot, extended walk, etc. I school all of these variations. A GP rider aims to have the horse balanced, active, prepared, and listening at all times to make any required change or transition at any time while maintaining the quality of the gaits throughout. Now add the pressure of a show environment and that reinback may not happen as well as it does back home.

BTW: What is the most important part of the reinback? It’s that first step forward when the energy coiled in the hind leg is released forward.

[Warmblood1]

Right, you are talking about transitions at GP. The RB itself is not a GP level movement.

[Roni4444]

Same here, working on GP with one horse, 4th with the other and both to TOF. TOH and RB every ride. If there is any resistance or hesitation, it becomes the guideline of the ride. Great tests of throughness and suppleness

[lazaret]

No, but what is expected of a grand prix horse is the opposite of what you get if you simply “stop and back up” where the horse typically brings the nose down and in to push backward from the shoulder and shuffle backward. Come to think of it, what is expected at 2nd level is more than that. Maintaining active steps going backward is quite tricky, so there’s a distinction between “stop and back up” and “forward going rein back” as a movement. Conflating the two as the same thing is a mistake.

[Warmblood1]

@lazaret

No, but what is expected of a Grand Prix horse is the opposite of what you get if you simply “stop and back up” where the horse typically brings the nose down and in to push backward from the shoulder and shuffle backward. Come to think of it, what is expected at 2nd level is more than that. Maintaining active steps going backward is quite tricky, so there’s a distinction between “stop and back up” and “forward going rein back” as a movement. Conflating the two as the same thing is a mistake.

“Pushing backward from the shoulder and shuffle backward” is not a true rein back. The rein back is a true 2 beat movement where the legs move backwards in diagonal pairs. If the horse is lowering the head and pushing from the shoulders, the hind end isn’t sufficiently engaged and the 2 beat movement will be sacrificed, IE., not a true and correct rein back. That doesn’t mean there should be a difference in a GP horse doing a RB compared to a 4th level horse. The added difficulty at GP comes from the transitions to and from RB.

Submission and engagement of the hind should be established at second level so training RB at second level is sufficient. That is why it has been introduced in tests starting at that level for the past 30 years.

[Warmblood1]

@Badger

BTW: What is the most important part of the reinback? It’s that first step forward when the energy coiled in the hind leg is released forward.

I would argue the most important aspect of a RB is the halt prior to it. If the halt is not square and on the forehand or rushed, the RB is doomed to begin with.

[lazaret]

And what was being discussed here was someone who is at best riding intro saying they “practice the rein back” when what they are doing is not, technically speaking, a rein back.

[BigMama1]

And claiming that top riders don’t practice the rb…

[Willesdon]

Reading this thread for the first time in a few weeks, what strikes me is how theoretical it is. I learnt most about rein back when out hacking with a lovely German-trained rider and watching her move her horse around to open a heavy five-bar wooden gate. And, given the difficulty of that particular gate, turns on forehand and quarters as well. All off her seat and leg and light hand. I think the situation made sense to the horse so he could help too. Watching Spanish Doma Vaquera also gives an eye-opening insight into the origins of many of the dressage moves.

As the wise person said: riding is simple but it isn’t easy.

[alicen]

@sparkygrace

Some trainers/riders us rein back as a punishment.

And unmounted as well - “getting control of the feet.”

[alicen]

@joiedevie99

the rein-back steps are diagonal and active.

How about replacing diagonal with lateral.

[MapleBreeze]

Dont you hate it when you practice rb and then your horse backs up in the halt. Then you have to reschool the trot halt trot so your horse doesnt take a backward step during your halts so you dont get a 4.

[alicen]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqnCDEyzEuo at 1:07

[alicen]

The thing about a rein back is the necessity of optimum timing of the back and forward aids. It’s not easy!

[SillyHorse]

@alicen

@joiedevie99

the rein-back steps are diagonal and active.

How about replacing diagonal with lateral.

No. Here is a good video. She talks about the legs moving in diagonal pairs at 4:05. The horse incorrectly moves back laterally; she corrects it and now he moves back properly, diagonally.

How to Rein Back!!!

[joiedevie99]

@alicen

How about replacing diagonal with lateral.

Nope - definitely diagonal. It should match the footfalls of the trot - just backwards.

[alicen]

Thank you. I got my pairs mixed up.

[alicen]

Totally off topic, but while you’re here: I made copies of your not TOP SECRET post. One will go onto the cover of my work folder so I can start the day with a laugh.

[SillyHorse]

@alicen

Totally off topic, but while your here: I made copies of your not TOP SECRET post. One will go onto the cover of my work folder so I can start the day with a laugh.

I think it’s hilarious, too.

[eightpondfarm]

interesting video. (I watched without sound, so if there’s a joke in there i wouldn’t know.
I see though an interesting pelvic tilt (forward which makes an arching back) that i’m not sure is quite a right way to sit a saddle… Am i the only person who sees this?