I totally understand that, and the article makes that clear, I thought. I was just trying to provide some documentation via the link. 
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AKC breed standard - Vizsla
Coat: Short, smooth, dense and close-lying, without woolly undercoat. A distinctly long coat is a
disqualification
AKC breed standard - Wirehaired Vizsla
Coat: Close lying, a length of approximately 1 inch, the dense wiry coat should not hide the outline of the body…Lacking undercoat or coat brushes on the back of the front legs should be
penalized, as is any deviation in coat texture or excessive length of the coat. (Bolding is mine.)
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There are varying views as to where this gene came into the breed but it is known that it came in many years ago, Some say it was from when an Irish setter was introduced into the breed.
I’ve never had a health guarantee on a dog I have bought. Not a horse either come to think of it. So a $300 puppy with a health guarantee of any kind was like a novelty.
Incidentally I have a 7yo dog from the same broker. 100% Amish bred purchased in an old school straight sale and everyone in the agility world who encounters him raves about him. He is UKI Titled and we just had a win in Speedstakes last weekend good for 6 more points and officially his Champion designation. He qualified for a bye in the Masters program at the US Open in FL last year but COVID and apathy so we didn’t attend. He was already Titled Champion in the International program at that point. I had offers to breed but his testicles were becoming problematic so they had to go at 3.5yo so no breeding for him. I regret it sometimes because he really is a unicorn in so many ways in and out of the ring.
There are no guarantees when it comes to the purchase of a live animal. You get what you see and buyer beware. It’s a live animal you make a commitment to care for, for better or for worse.
Also incidentally, broker made small talk during the sale with her associate and they discussed a crazy lady who was threatening to sue because she bought a female puppy, and oops the paperwork said “M” for gender so she was going to sue because she thought she bought a male and said it was false advertising. So your position quoted above couldn’t be further from the truth. People (general) are insane and yes, they will try to return and get their money back for a puppy (dog) years after the sale for crazy made up reasons. THAT’s what breeders know, that people, general, are utterly insane.
This is the most ridiculous example I’ve ever heard. But I think it’s possible that people buy a puppy without ever having met the breeder, seen the litter, and the breeder knows nothing about the buyer either. So yeah - possible that the breeder accidentally misrepresented the gender of the puppy and somehow the buyer never even looked at the time of pickup.
The point I’m making is that a good breeder doesn’t just give a refund or return policy on a puppy. They actually select and health test the parents before the breeding occurs, so that the puppies are less likely to have health problems to begin with.
Of course it’s not a guarantee that the puppy will never have ANY health issue. But - my puppy came from a breeding line of 5+ generations of good or excellent hips (by OFA). The chances that my puppy will have hip dysplasia are less than the general population of dogs of his breed. (A lot less, actually.) There is no benefit to me to have a return the dog guarantee on his hips - I wouldn’t return the dog either. I prefer that the money be spent in advance, not after the dog has dysplasia.
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All my purebreds came with one on top of a “return for any reason” clause. Basically, take the pup to the vet and/or your mentor within the first two weeks and, if you find anything you don’t like, return said pup for a full refund. After that, you can ALWAYS return the pup, no questions asked but also no refund.
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Someone in a dog group posted a picture yesterday of their Sprockerpoo. With absolutely no explanation, just assumed everyone would know what that means. Many people asked, and very little information was given, as though of course we should know. “The mother is a Sprocker and the father a toy Poodle.” Okay, but what is a Sprocker?! Eventually someone piped up that they think it’s a Springer Spaniel / Cocker Spaniel mix. Oy…
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Oy is right.
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My contract says I must return the dog if I can’t keep it. If I rehomed it without notifying the breeder it is a breach of contract.
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Interesting discussion of the health guarantee here. I had one for my pup - purebred from a very well respected breeder. Vet check within 1 business day of the day I picked up the dog, and if she failed, I had the right to return her for a refund.
You can bet your bottom dollar I’d have returned her if there’d been anything significant. But one of my guiding shopping principles is that it’s just as easy to fall in love with a sound horse as a lame horse, and the same applies to dogs.
ETA my contract with my breeder also requires that I return the dog to her if I can’t keep her.
Edit #2 - I had 2 weeks for a vet check too. One day did seem short!
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Why? Springers are awesome dogs (the field type are smart as a whip). We have a Springer field bred spaniel and we hope to get another one some day. What are they looking for with a Poodle cross? Pretending the hair will be hypoallergenic? That’s a load of dung. Springers shed hair. No double coat. A cross will shed anyway, so you lost the true non-shedding aspect as soon as you stepped away from purebred Poodle. There’s really nothing to improve there. I’m as frustrated as you guys are about thee designer breeds. None of it makes any sense.
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The dog pictured did not have a curly Poodle coat either, it was a slightly curly slick spaniel coat sigh
Same, except I had two weeks.
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I don’t know why anyone would sign that other then it being 100% unenforceable.
Commendable on the part of the breeder, for sure, but just words if the owner declines to adhere.
Legally unenforceable, perhaps. But the dog community is small, the breed club community is smaller still. I imagine that violators would find themselves shunned by reputable breeders.
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I don’t see any reason why that contract provision would be unenforceable - the difficulty would be in getting the remedy you want (return of the dog) vs damages. Whatever.
Breeders do it because they are committed to the dogs they send into the world. They know that stuff happens, and they want to be the one to make as sure as possible that the dog goes to an appropriate place. My breed is awesome - for the right owner. It’s not awesome for everyone, and the community is small, tigntknit, and committed. I can’t say what a positive experience it has been for me to be involved in it even in a small way.
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Agreed. Although I think it’s enforceable; I signed a contract and the dog could be considered an asset. He wasn’t cheap. It wouldn’t be easy, of course, but I think I could be sued for breach of contract at least.
For sure if I rehomed the dog without contacting the breeder it would definitely get around and would not be looked on favorably in that breed community.
In my case, I have no issue with this. If I can’t keep the dog for some reason, I know the breeder could rehome it to another appropriate home. If I knew of an appropriate home, I would call them to discuss and they would likely agree.
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Eh, it’s just as “legally enforceable” than a “first rite of refusal” clause in selling a horse - you CAN enforce it in court but it’ll cost more than the dog is likely worth.
That said, I do know of a breeder who used it in court to get dogs back after they were dumped at a “rescue” that was more worried about trying to “adopt” the dog out for $$$ than getting them into a home and making way for dogs who didn’t have a safety net. And of course, said rescue cried all over social media about how the evil breeder forced them to hand over the dogs afterwards.
Dropping back in to add that we ran into a BoBox the other day at the dog park.
The owner said she adopted it as an 3 month old puppy from a no-kill shelter, where it had been dropped off with its mother and littermates. The shelter had written “BoBox” as the breed on the adoption papers - apparently the former owners had told the shelter the mother was a Boxer (although I’m wondering if it was an “American Boxer”), and the sire was a neighbor’s Border Collie.
It was a sweet dog but I couldn’t see much Border Collie or Boxer in it - just looked like some kind of non-descript mutt with a brindle and white coat. It was a smart dog though - the lady said she had taken it to obedience classes and the trainer was amazed at how quickly the dog picked things up.
That almost never happens because there’s two sides to every story and the dog world is hella political.
10K to start to go to court, and that’s just to get in front of a judge once. There’s very few breeders willing/able to shell out 5 figures to enforce a contract. But the threat of harassment alone is enough to make me want to avoid it.
If I am unable to care for my dogs at some point in the future, they will go to my trainer. I would never return them to where they came from even if that was an option. Most breeders homes are like kennels with the number of dogs and activity in the home at any given time and my dogs would be stressed and miserable in that kind of environment after years of being one of at most two dogs and one person household. I know what’s best for my animals, not some stranger who bred their dams and raised them to 9-12 weeks. Honestly that’s crazy.
I think if a breeder is so concerned with controlling the destiny of every animal they put on the ground, they probably should only breed animals they will keep forever and ever themselves. And that’s ok, to each his own, but this whole continued lifetime of control by a breeder/limited ownership rights on dogs is nuts to me.
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