[QUOTE=grayarabpony;7624429]
I could care a less about what you write to Reece Miller, or anything else you have to say.[/QUOTE]
LOL, well of course you don’t!:lol: Oh by the way, the correct insult is “couldn’t care less”. Carry on!
Also look up the meaning and use of sarcasm and idioms.
I’m not surprised you’re conversing with bayhawk. 
ROFLMAO! Is this the part where I’m suppose to be insulted or something? It’s still technically incorrect regardless of what some blog says. However, your predictability is quite amusing.
Next?
[QUOTE=Bayhawk;7624398]
No one is arguing about the need for TB blood. The title of the thread is TB kills jump… not does a warmblood need TB blood.[/QUOTE]
No breeder in Holstein or outside Holstein would use TB if it would kill the jump. In eventing they need to jump too and I have heared several times the last months from many different people (eventing riders, breeders) that a eventing horse still need 70 % TB to keep up in a CCI class.
A personal note; it is interesting that it is suddenly no problem anymore for not being a rider. Because for you Bayhawk it was a problem that I wasn’t a rider… I have groomed a year and a half for the recent Hamburger Derby winner Nisse Lüneburg as a home groom. But to you that did not matter at all. His horse has also a lot of blood; http://www.horsetelex.nl//horses/pedigree/299284
Fourbeats:
Again, look up the use and meaning of sarcasm and idioms.
Didn’t take long for you to reach ignore land at all. This thread doesn’t need another troll, it has enough already.
Thanks for not disappointing! We all need more humor.
[QUOTE=grayarabpony;7624506]
Fourbeats:
Again, look up the use and meaning of sarcasm and idioms.
Didn’t take long for you to reach ignore land at all. This thread doesn’t need another troll, it has enough already.[/QUOTE]
Said the leader of the trolls…
[QUOTE=grayarabpony;7624429]
I could care a less about what you write to Reece Miller, or anything else you have to say.[/QUOTE]
Wow GAP…you are so interested in what I have to say that you have conducted an investigation and found out my name. I’m honored that you are so interested in me !
I could have saved you some time though…all you had to do was ask me.
No investigation needed. Your name has been posted on here before.
[QUOTE=grayarabpony;7624429]
I could care a less about what you write to Reece Miller, or anything else you have to say.[/QUOTE]
So instead of putting people on ignore you constantly engage them in personally insulting dialogue and try and discharge them from the conversation. Even when I ignored you, you persisted for like 5 posts with insulting comments directed at me , while at the same time telling me not to respond.
Your behaviour is, in my opinion, inappropriate. I hope the mods also see it as inappropriate as according to their rules.
[QUOTE=Bachus;7624505]
No breeder in Holstein or outside Holstein would use TB if it would kill the jump. In eventing they need to jump too and I have heared several times the last months from many different people (eventing riders, breeders) that a eventing horse still need 70 % TB to keep up in a CCI class.
A personal note; it is interesting that it is suddenly no problem anymore for not being a rider. Because for you Bayhawk it was a problem that I wasn’t a rider… I have groomed a year and a half for the recent Hamburger Derby winner Nisse Lüneburg as a home groom. But to you that did not matter at all. His horse has also a lot of blood; http://www.horsetelex.nl//horses/pedigree/299284[/QUOTE]
Ok Adrianna…you ask the question so here goes. Remember , I haven’t done anything but agree with you until this point.
You were giving breeding advice to people. You not being a rider…Coupled with the fact that you have never been a breeder or never been an owner of horses casts considerable doubt on why you would be trying to give breeding advice to anyone.
You don’t ride , you have never been a breeder ,nor have you ever owned a horse. I’m not trying to pick a fight with you Adrianna…remember , you asked the question.
You don’t have to be a rider to be a good breeder. Considering where you live…you should know this.
I also think you have a lot to offer people here. You are a very good writer of articles and you are in the middle of what is going on in Holstein in the current moment.
I dis-agree with you…breeders in Holstein are NOT using TB’s because they do kill the jump. This is why there were only 24 foals born by TB stallions out of 3,000 foals born in total .
The breeders have almost ZERO confidence in using a TB Stallion right now. If they didn’t kill the jump in the first generation ,they would be used more. If they didn’t kill the jump in the first generation ,the Verband wouldn’t have their 2500 euro buy back program in place for the colts.
Just my opinion…
Yes, eventing horses also have to jump:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0a/R3DE_XCountry.JPG
[QUOTE=stoicfish;7624555]
So instead of putting people on ignore you constantly engage them in personally insulting dialogue and try and discharge them from the conversation. Even when I ignored you, you persisted for like 5 posts with insulting comments directed at me , while at the same time telling me not to respond.
Your behaviour is, in my opinion, inappropriate. I hope the mods also see it as inappropriate as according to their rules.[/QUOTE]
Actually, I was correcting the false information that you had posted. If you want to call that insulting and inappropriate, that’s your problem. As a matter of fact, you called me a troll for disagreeing with your false information.
What, pray tell, do you think bayhawk has been doing, if not insulting people??
Can this thread get back on track, instead of talking about bayhawk, and stoicifish’s apparently hurt feelings? Why dont we talk about the fact that Thomas Nissen DOES want to continue to use Thoroughbreds in Holsteiner breeding? Or anything else, for that matter.
Apparently Wallenda is the sire of Inmidair, Jan Byyny’s horse, ranked fifth this April in the world eventing standings. Wallenda is a grandson of Mr. Prospector.
http://www.wbfsh.org/files/April_Eventing_horse.pdf
http://www.pedigreequery.com/wallenda
Pluto Mio, ranked 15th, is out of a TB mare who is a Seattle Slew granddaughter.
http://www.sporthorse-data.com/d?d=Pluto+mio&x=-866&y=-27
Those are just 2 examples of the horses in eventing that are descended from No. Dancer or Mr P or Seattle Slew.
Here’s another one, entered at Rolex, Houdini, registered name Rocky Times: http://www.pedigreequery.com/rocky+times
And another: http://www.pedigreequery.com/daniel+Alexander, shown under the name Irish Rhythm.
http://www.pedigreequery.com/merisa+g, shown under the name Mensa G by Michael Pollard.
http://www.pedigreequery.com/eastside+park, shown under the name Parker by James Alliston.
Horses like these, along with Thomas Edison and Arkansas, show that Northern Dancer and Mr. Prospector are not the death knell for TB horses in sport.
If they didn’t kill the jump in the first generation ,the Verband wouldn’t have their 2500 euro buy back program in place for the colts.
But you know more than the Verband, don’t you? If they have the buying program, they MUST want the addition of TB (and other outcross?) blood.
I’m sorry you think the gold medal winner in the Beijing Olympics (which, if I recall correctly, you were proud to claim for Holstein) in eventing had no jump, because
I’d like to see your modern showjumper try ANY jumping course the day after a world class XC run, much less twice in the same day. BTW, the bronze medal went to a full TB.
Tell us about your competition riding, Bayhawk, and about all the 1.60 level horses you have bred to date.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;7624592]
But you know more than the Verband, don’t you? If they have the buying program, they MUST want the addition of TB (and other outcross?) blood.[/QUOTE]
Geeze Viney, I am not an expert on the Holstein Verband like Reece, but even I can read between the lines on this one.
[QUOTE=Noms;7624600]
Geeze Viney, I am not an expert on the Holstein Verband like Reece, but even I can read between the lines on this one.[/QUOTE]
The breeders don’t want F1s except as mares, per Bayhawk, and not even then if he is correct; to encourage the production of F1s the Verband gives them an incentive to try and pays enough to cover the reproductive cost if they happen to get a colt–which may then go on to be a gold medal winning event horse with his 76% Blood.
You know one of the first effects of inbreeding depression is reproductive problems. Has that affected the Holstein breeders yet? Reason I asked is one of Bachus’s posts that mentioned 1000 foal losses.
[QUOTE=Bayhawk;7624556]
Ok Adrianna…you ask the question so here goes. Remember , I haven’t done anything but agree with you until this point.
You were giving breeding advice to people. You not being a rider…Coupled with the fact that you have never been a breeder or never been an owner of horses casts considerable doubt on why you would be trying to give breeding advice to anyone.
You don’t ride , you have never been a breeder ,nor have you ever owned a horse. I’m not trying to pick a fight with you Adrianna…remember , you asked the question.
You don’t have to be a rider to be a good breeder. Considering where you live…you should know this.
I also think you have a lot to offer people here. You are a very good writer of articles and you are in the middle of what is going on in Holstein in the current moment.
I dis-agree with you…breeders in Holstein are NOT using TB’s because they do kill the jump. This is why there were only 24 foals born by TB stallions out of 3,000 foals born in total .
The breeders have almost ZERO confidence in using a TB Stallion right now. If they didn’t kill the jump in the first generation ,they would be used more. If they didn’t kill the jump in the first generation ,the Verband wouldn’t have their 2500 euro buy back program in place for the colts.
Just my opinion…[/QUOTE]
I worked with more Holsteiners then you have, I have been a groom since 2008 at several big showjumping stables. I live now for 2.5 years in Holstein. My boots have been more in the Holsteiner mudd then yours. Working with over 6 years with more horses then I could have ever owned is giving me a better insight in what is going on in several area’s where I have worked.
TB’s don’t kill the jump, many breeders are scared for not getting their foals sold. The breeders quit breeding, we lost 25 % of the born foals in 10 years. Or they quit or they start using stallions that will produce foals that will be sold like Casall.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;7624625]
The breeders don’t want F1s except as mares, per Bayhawk, and not even then if he is correct; to encourage the production of F1s the Verband gives them an incentive to try and pays enough to cover the reproductive cost if they happen to get a colt–which may then go on to be a gold medal winning event horse with his 76% Blood.
You know one of the first effects of inbreeding depression is reproductive problems. Has that affected the Holstein breeders yet? Reason I asked is one of Bachus’s posts that mentioned 1000 foal losses.[/QUOTE]
Heck yeah, they’ll sell the F1s they don’t want to use for breeding as riding horses, just like they do the majority of horses that they breed. They have a system set up to sell eventers now (and even a format to suit them). Plus, it isn’t as though F1 or purebred stallions haven’t produced their fair share of successful 1.6m jumpers.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;7624625]
The breeders don’t want F1s except as mares, per Bayhawk, and not even then if he is correct; to encourage the production of F1s the Verband gives them an incentive to try and pays enough to cover the reproductive cost if they happen to get a colt–which may then go on to be a gold medal winning event horse with his 76% Blood.
You know one of the first effects of inbreeding depression is reproductive problems. Has that affected the Holstein breeders yet? Reason I asked is one of Bachus’s posts that mentioned 1000 foal losses.[/QUOTE]
No this started with the economical disaster world wide. Plus the last years and the coming years many old breeders are dying with no relatives who continue with their mares. This is a serious problem in Holstein I don’t know how this is in other parts of Germany. The last 25 years and even longer many Holsteiner mares have been sold to the Netherlands and Belgium, with a new pilot project the Holsteiner Verband is trying to get those mares with foals back in the Holsteiner Studbook. It will be interesting to see offspring from stallions that are not used much in Holstein itself but who are approved by the Holsteiner Verband.
