The "heavy" horse and the hunter ring

[cswoodlandfairy]

@findeight: I definitely have my fair share of terrible videos, so I can relate!! They are just set to private I actually have a copy of the book so I will start using it and setting up some of her pole exercises (its been sadly collecting dust on my shelf

@dags: I do ride him leading up but I dont do as strenuous stuff, but now you have me thinking I may just need to keep the pattern the same regardless and honestly on “days off” ride but maybe trail ride instead of having the time off. I will have to play with that.

@Ponyplusaninch: yep he always gets a round of gastroguard when he shows!

@fivestrideline: Oh I totally agree, I do NOT help with the situation. I think since we’ve had some miscommunication issues and his stops, the trust isnt as strong as my other. So that is a work in progress. When we go to most shows, we actually ship in. So he goes for the day and then immediately gets turn out right after. He hasnt had to stable this year yet, maybe end of the year finals if we go. Luckily my location makes daily ship ins easy! I think at times instead of allowing him to move forward I chase which definitely doesnt help the situation because I am worried he will stop (which happens anywhere honestly). My trainer has been on him. When we struggle I always have her get on as she can feel things better than see. I will admit after some of her rides I have been demoted to walk trot only haha. So she will find the gaps and we will go back to basics if she finds the gaps.

[MHM]

@JBCool

As far as something to do at the show, what about halting in each corner in addition to doing the add step?

Just be aware that if you’re at a USEF show, or a show that follows USEF rules, the halt can be counted as a refusal. Ditto for an additional circle on course.

So your plan for a relaxed schooling trip might not involve getting all the way around the course if you get eliminated for three refusals before you jump all the jumps. (Or two refusals in a jumper class.)

Trotting in the corner- not a refusal.
Walking in the corner- not a refusal.
Halting anywhere on course- refusal.

(Unless the halt is a course requirement for a test.)

[Trekkie]

What a nice horse and what a lot of good suggestions you have had, and good for you for being brave enough to post videos. To me it just looks like everything has been just a tad rushed. The horse is not quite ready and he is anxious. You are anxious and also not quite ready WITH HIM. You both need to use the shows as a tool at this point to learn to slow down and relax a bit more. Take your time, get there super early, relax and have a walk and a graze, longe if you feel he is explosive. Hack around then go back to the stall. Do everything you possibly can to allow him to relax and release his anxiety. Go back to smaller jumps so you don’t have to be worried about the stopping at shows. It will give both of you more confidence. Take ten deep breaths. Have fun with him. Enjoy the process. Give him the ride he needs, not the ride you think you need to do for the “hunters”. You are his guide. Convey relaxation and confidence. Even if you do that for another year. Continue the good flatwork at home. We ask so much of young horses. Instead of looking for the bigger bit or the chemical solution we need to help them find their happy place with our ACTIONS. You guys will get there. Have patience. And then more patience!

[JBCool]

Hmmm…did not know that a halt (anywhere) = refusal. That wouldn’t have crossed my mind. Walking in the corner would do the same thing if you come all the way down to a relaxed walk. A pat when he really relaxes too.

[Tini_Sea_Soldier1]

Not recent whatsoever. We weren’t allowed to show in them 20 years ago! Just because you weren’t caught doesn’t mean it’s legal. Hooks aren’t allowed. There are Myler bits now with the straight D though.

Update/Edit: Sounds like it can be penalized but won’t get you tossed out:

a. Judges may penalize, but may not eliminate, a horse or pony that competes in a snaffle, pelham, or full bridle that is unconventional. Unconventional snaffles, pelhams, or full bridles include, but are not limited to, hunter gags, kimberwickes, etc. May 29, 2024

[EmilyM]

I’m pretty sure the hooks make it a hunter gag which is legal.

[fivestrideline]

Yep, as I said, unconventional not illegal, but really hard to see from the judge’s booth so unless you have a judge that really cares about it you’re more likely to be penalized for a less optimal round vs the bit itself.

FWIW I’ve ridden a few OTTBs that had this scoot/rush as a habit when anxious. One went nicely in a Pelham with two reins, the other actually went in a plain leather mouth mullen snaffle. Both improved with lots of trot fences and basic dressage.

[MHM]

@fivestrideline

but really hard to see from the judge’s booth so unless you have a judge that really cares about it you’re more likely to be penalized for a less optimal round vs the bit itself.

I wouldn’t say those bits are that hard to see from the judge’s booth unless the booth happens to be pretty far from the side of the ring. But some judges will certainly care about that bit more than others.

[MHM]

@JBCool

Hmmm…did not know that a halt (anywhere) = refusal. That wouldn’t have crossed my mind.

It’s in the USEF Rulebook.

HU 124.2.c.

Also of note for the OP is HU 124.1.i, which says that adding a stride can be considered a major or minor fault by the judge, depending on the severity and the division.

On that subject, I would say that from the judging standpoint, it’s better to add in all the lines so that the pace stays consistent, rather than adding in one or two lines.

Adding smoothly in every line can look like a plan. Adding inconsistently usually looks like a mistake.

[JBCool]

I guess most of the time I’ve seen or had to consider it, a “refusal” of that type would have been the lesser evil

[CBoylen]

There are more judges that care about the Hunter gags than there are that do not. I would not chance it.

[Demerara_Stables]

@EmilyM

I’m pretty sure the hooks make it a hunter gag which is legal.

Sorry, what are “hooks”?

[findeight]

Have you thought about having trainer ride in a little schooling class? He’s scared/anxious and thinks “you mean you are scared too? ”

Might be a good idea to pay her to take a spin for you.

[Demerara_Stables]

@findeight

Have you thought about having trainer ride in a little schooling class? He’s scared/anxious and thinks “you mean you are scared too? ”

Might be a good idea to pay her to take a spin for you.

I also think it’s incredibly helpful as a rider to see that the horse can do it in a more relaxed way. I love to have my clients watch me ride because sometimes they can’t envision a horse going a certain way until they see it.

[EmilyM]

The slots around the Dee.

[Demerara_Stables]

On a kimberwicke? Why are they called hooks and not slots? I’m so confused

[Ghazzu]

On a D ring.
Perhaps a picture would be helpful:

[pony_grandma]

Trainer rides - If the trainer rides better than they train.

Why is this horse ‘far more suited for the hunter ring’? I don’t see the relaxation. the rhythmic pace, the stride that says hunter prospect. How is he ‘heavy?’ I expected a plodder vs a little short and quick likes to scoot.

If you go to the YouTube channel you will see other horses ridden this same way.

I’m beyond saying what the suggestions should be - definitely not more bit.

[Demerara_Stables]

Ohhh that kind of D. Thanks!

[EmilyM]

I’ve always called these hooks. And if you google Hunter gag, the myler bit comes up. That is what we were discussing (I thought?). Kimberwicke is also allowed in the hunter ring.

Not sure who, but someone suggested these bits are not allowed in the Hunter ring but I believe they are called hunter gags and they are allowed.