In order to file a protest, you need hard facts. Not so and so is training for him. You need documentation. Even canceled checks can be gotten around. I got paid for selling a horse, legal. I took so & so to a show, legal. Feeling that a rule has been misused is not enough.
harry… get off my menopause… It is a disease… it requires total kindness, understanding and SUBMISSION on the part of the male partner who is forced to deal with it. However… there is a point when the male species is allowed to end the collective misery.
I bet you think they are different…proves my point exactly!
I was horrified as an adult.
Point well taken, WA. On this thread, PV has become the poster boy for No Reinstatement, but at this point, I feel that anyone who has been suspended for the same crime as PV, should not be reinstated. My arguments, however, remain the same.
Where did you post the BB rules? That according to what you posted was USEF rules… What are you talking about??
Originally posted by big dawg:
yes, IF it also tightened up the drug sampling of both riders and horses, and stopped the legalized medication that goes on now that keeps sore horses in the game just because some lady or parent wants to continue to “play” at being a rider.
Well, let’s see how things shake down. We’ve got 5 years between this round of reinstatement eligibility and the next one, maybe we could play around with the D&M thing again inbetweentimes to keep everybody entertained. 
Gonna be a way harder sell than reinstatement, though, IMO. 
I would seriously doubt that the “credit” in the rule is intended to include giving someone credit for helping a person win. That’s got violation of the First Amendment written all over it.
Originally posted by Erin:
I’m not sure I quite understand your question Linus… but, IMO, I would consider “making a contribution to the horse community” something that someone does for which they DO NOT get paid, first of all. And also that would be for the betterment of the community, not just for ribbons.
A few examples I can think of off the top of my head… Robert Dover’s Equestrian AIDS Foundation, the Horses in the Hood program (I think that’s Kathy Kusner?), the folks who used their farm semis to shuttle feed, grain and supplies down to the Gulf Coast after Katrina… stuff like that.
I don’t really think the intent of the suspension was to say that these people could not be involved in horses AT ALL during their suspensions (although some people here seem to be of the opinion that the suspendees should have done that of their own volition).
I know some think that the suspendees are “contributing to the horse community” by training people and winning… but I have a sneaking suspicion that that’s not REALLY what the USEF had in mind. 
It seems like most of PV’s attempts at “giving” to the animal community has a great deal of self-promotion involved
Well, I can’t help it if the tone of this thing conjures up those images in my head. I can’t put my finger on it, but something doesn’t feel “right” about the whole thing.
Not to worry Equitator, she still has to ask if she has the right diagonal.
All you guys really need is a couple of signatures. The bottom line is that it doesn’t matter how many successful GP riders or former Olympic riders or USEF board members support reinstatement. Get Anheuser-Busch, Rolex, or one or more of the other major sponsors behind you
So true. Here is a list of the sponsors on the USEF page.
http://www.usef.org/content/marketing/sponsors.php
Time to fire up the old network and find some key folks.
Hit them where their wallets are! Isn’t that the saying??
PLEASE can we keep it civil? Let’s not turn this into a “Let’s Bash Chanda” thread for x more pages.
I happen to disagree with Chanda, rather vehemently, as to whether the reinstatement of the “horse killers” is a current horse welfare issue or not. But we’ve always been able to be polite about the disagreement and I hope that will continue.
The reason I believe it IS a current horse welfare issue is that USEF has already reinstated one of these people, and will probably reinstate the rest as and when they become eligible to apply, UNLESS there is significant public opposition to that.
As I’ve stated many times, I don’t feel that reinstatement is appropriate for ANY of these people. You knowingly kill a horse for profit - you should no longer be a member of USEF.
Originally posted by Uberraschung:
Um I’m pretty certain that The Jockey Club and USEF are two entirely separate entities. Why would you go for support from people who have nothing to do with the organization you are trying to keep someone banned from? Why wouldn’t you go after actual members of the USEF?
Because (to reiterate) the petition will be sent to the USOC and the FEI as well as USEF. Thus, we need to demonstrate support from all areas of the equine industry.
Also - without going into vast amounts of detail - the equine industry is kind of a small world. There are plenty of JC people with direct ties to USEF, if not to this very case itself. Some of them are, uh, VERY interested in this case. Very.
Yes, I think in North Carolina we have two Meredith Taylor and P.Wynn Norman.
Pete Rose was not allowed to return to baseball.
Sport is a luxury, not a necessity. The courts have one set of rules to follow and USEF has another. To the law, killing a horse isn’t a crime - it’s the fraudluent claim against the insurance company. In our community we see it a bit differently. Killing an animal to avoid professional embarrassment is not an ethical act. Lying about it to an insurance company not only is a crime, it directly affects all of us horse owners who wish to insure our animals, through higher costs and increased hassle. It is not unusual for a sporting organization to have higher standards for conduct than US law.
And I will restate my particular beef with this individual, that warming up people off the grounds for classes at shows and similarly thwarting the spirit if not the absolute letter of the suspension leaves me rather skeptical about any level of remorse.
Very well said Poltroon,
OK, here is a question for all of you folks that would like PV to be reinstated or perhaps would like no one to speak out against PV:
Do you not want to sign the petition/speak out against his actions because you feel that doing so would be disloyal to a friend/colleague? Or do you really believe in your heart that people who kill horses should be allowed full membership rights and privileges in the United States Equestrian Federation (“USEF”)?
I am not trying to judge but rather understand. There may be two sides to the other side of the fence. I disagree (obviously from my previous posts) with anyone that believes horse killers should be allowed full membership rights and privileges in the USEF but I believe in the power of discussion.
”If you don’t do your own thinking someone else will do it for you”….Edward de Bono
I’m not sure when he “started” doing barn work, perhaps now because he doesn’t have as many horses as before. Sure, he has a good size staff still - but I can assure you that he mucks out, especially on Mondays.
You guys are all amazing with your funny little statements you can come up with to portray your poit of view. I was simply stating what is fact…I know. Paul is at the barn long before we all were. He would have several stalls mucked by the time I got to work. At the end of the day we would all be getting in our cars and Paul would be mucking again. I don’t think that this is that big of a deal, but the fact that you think of things to say that are bad about it…this whole board is just a joke now.
I will caution you, if the USEF showed no interest at their convention, I doubt that even pressure from the media will do anything. Perhaps it is time to give up on the issue.
Now Harry, be careful, you may not be able to maintain your image as the “darling of the COTH BB” with that kind of attitude
Well I can think of a few rabble rousers that may still endorse the HJ for president theme. Maybe a certain Sheilagh or a large canine.
