The "NO REINSTATEMENT" thread.

[War_Admiral]

Did PV off a client’s horse? without permission?

NO, HE DID NOT. Let’s please do our best to stick to the facts. That would be a very ugly and unfair rumor to start, and I want no part of it.

My understanding is that Mr. Valliere himself owned Roseau Platiere.

Now - speaking to equine insurance fraud just in general - without referring to anyone specifically - there’s a lot to make it attractive. Horsie has a “bizarre trailering accident”; owner not only gets to collect the insurance proceeds BUT ALSO gets to take a tax write-off on horsie.

Unfortunately, it’s also a sad fact that a lot of equine insurance companies THEMSELVES send a horse to the killer auctions. If you file a loss of use claim on an insured horse, that horse becomes the property of the insurance company to do with as they see fit. Apparently some of them find it too expensive to humanely euthanize.

BTW, been out of town for a funeral & just got back… I’ll have the new article up on the site in a few mins.

Ave atque vale, BigDawg, I’ll actually miss ya.

EDIT: the No Reinstatement site has been updated adding the NJ Star-Ledger article.

[Snowbird]

Well poltroon I wish some benefits came with it. All I can think of is what a jerk I am. If I had signed up for a Life Membership what a ton of money I would have saved. If I remember correctly it was $500.00 Who knew then I’d still be here? I thought a year or two and I’d be back into Fine Arts. Sure not the brightest bulb in the string.

[HipNo34]

I didn’t want to wade back into the tangent of whether or not some of the killings were “as bad” or “not as bad as” or “how is it different from” having sent a horse off to the SH. That is, most aknowledge, another issue for another day. But since it still seems to be floating out there, even in the form of passing comments…

These killings, many of us consider to be the larger of TWO crimes. The idea of horses being unnecessarily “disposed” of every day is tragic and true. So, if we know better, if we have the means, if we the options, we excercise them and thereby set an example and call it a start on the problem. Moving on…

But, not only were these horses needlessly “disposed of” in inhumane fashion, they were also disposed of in the process of committing a felony (um, correct me if I’m wrong on the felony bit).

Likable, not likable, talent, no talent, an asset or not, remorseful or not… I’m sure one or more of the above in any number of combinations apply to the individuals involved. So leaving the professional and personal defense/offense stuff out…this still isn’t on par with flunking a drug test a few too many times. Killing a horse to commit a serious, serious crime is three strikes in one.

And if people have changed, have deep and abiding regret, that’s good and that’s important. They can be those changed men and women, ply their trades as better people and still contribute to the world. They can just do it sans USEF cards.

circles, circles… where IS my beer?

[Snowbird]

I have not had any orders since the old thread was closed. Someone out there must still need bracelets.

I finally got the links up and running.[B]

NO-REINSTEMENT BRACELETS FOR SALE[/B]

On the same page are all the links to the Petition and the Web Site and the Items for sale.

The links for Paypal all should work. You can order any number of bracelets either singly or in groups of five each. And, anyone who would like to make a donation can make it. I have just gotten safe envelopes to use for return mail of the bracelets.

God Bless! and may we get a zillion signatures so we can prove that the “grassroots” are strong and hardy and we won’t rub shoulders at our shows with convicted felons who have defrauded Insurance Companies and horse owners of the just returns.

Like weeds we are strong and invincible!

[Boberry]

Originally posted by xegeba:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-title”>quote:</div><div class=“ip-ubbcode-quote-content”>Posted Dec. 18, 2005 11:03 PM
what they don’t read this Throw us a bone…actually that

yes, Boberry… The Chron is all over this one. i’m shocked that you have not received a PT from them. or IT. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>yet xegeba you keep posting, keep the politics up, use some religon, when will you realize your kicking a dead horse…

[Fairview_Horse_Cente]

Originally posted by anthem35:
During the past two weeks in Wellie,
I have had the pleaseure of having dinner on 3 separate occassions with 3 BIG name judges…
Where I was asked the inevitable question that we all seem get to when meeting newcomers “Who do you train with?”

Each time, upon hearing the I train with Paul, the response was the same.

“Good Man, Great trainer. We will be happy to see him back at the ring”.
In two cases, the trainers and either their children, or family, trained with him currently.

If they truly feel that way, then they wouldn’t mind attaching their names to that statement. We have attached ours.

[Sheila_H]

Just like in the movies - you need good guys and bad guys. Except in my movie, the bad guy always wins.

[War_Admiral]

Thanks for the kudos, but Lori B. and Horse_Poor get the credit for the Cafe Press stuff! Lori B. did the logo & Horse_Poor did the product design.

As of right now, we aren’t making ANY money on the shirts but in the highly unlikely event that we do, it will go to the No Reinstatement fund to be used for stuff like ads and possibly a trophy sponsorship.

[grey_mare]

Personally, I could care less if he’s sorry. This is about his possible reinstatement, which I do not believe would be a good thing for the horse show industry. It is up to the governing body to set and uphold ethical standards, for the best of all.

[xegeba]

now THAT was a straight answer.

[Sheila_H]

funniest post ever

[Jumphigh83]

Originally posted by slainte!:

also, he’s a busy man. much too busy to be monitoring what everyone thinks about him!

I doubt it…but there is no such thing as bad publicity I guess.
PS He probably has “little people” for that!

[filly3]

In my mind Anthem35’s sentiments on child molestation could be easily changed to something like this:

I understand this completely and would not ever want my horses in the hands of a horse killer.

Horse killing and subsequent insurance fraud is a result of mental depravity, sickness, ego and greed.

I do not believe that this can be cured.

[RNB]

Me either War Admiral. A little help Harry.

[JuniorJumper01]

You’re intentionally missing my point Snowbird. Look at anyone riding professionally at the top levels and tell me they’re doing it for recreation. Open your eyes and get real, lady. I don’t care what the government calls it. Bowling is for recreation; riding, training, and selling horses for a living is not. And the fact that USEF is “non-profit” doesn’t mean it is not still a business orginazation.

I understand free enterprise. I didn’t say anything about a dictatorship with unhappy staff/clients. And again, morals didn’t get us where we are today. Unless of course you consider forcing Native Americans off of their land and enslaving Africans for our own economic prosperity moral. I could continue with the injustices of this country, but we can leave it at that for the time being.

And as for the God issue, I will agree with you as a Christian who has gone to a private Baptist school her whole life. However, there is also that little roadblock of mixing church and state…

[Snowbird]

Good Night Harry! Sleep well.

[poltroon]

Originally posted by Serah:
I have a question here… please recognize that this is a QUESTION, I am not trying to get stoned to death here. When these men were indicted, they were tried, and found guilty and given a sentence to punish them. They have served that sentence. Evidently there is a huge following of people who are unhappy with the sentence, but it seems to me, the time for petitioning and campaigning this point was at the sentencing!! When someone serves a jail sentence and is released to society, we don’t take them back to jail and put them back in because we dont personally believe they deserve to return to society! It would undermine the entire justice system! A sentence is basically a contract between society and a criminal that says that we feel they need to serve “X” amount of time for what they have done. People don’t have to personally forgive them, but when a sentence is up, it’s up. So where was this protest when the indicted were sentenced?? And if over 1600 people are willing to sign a petition, and we have people buying shirts and such, wouldn’t it be more beneficial for the industry to focus the protest on the act itself and prevention of it, instead of people who have already been found guilty and been sentenced, and served their time??? Just looking for opinions here, not to be burned at the stake!!!

Pete Rose was not allowed to return to baseball.

Sport is a luxury, not a necessity. The courts have one set of rules to follow and USEF has another. To the law, killing a horse isn’t a crime - it’s the fraudluent claim against the insurance company. In our community we see it a bit differently. Killing an animal to avoid professional embarrassment is not an ethical act. Lying about it to an insurance company not only is a crime, it directly affects all of us horse owners who wish to insure our animals, through higher costs and increased hassle. It is not unusual for a sporting organization to have higher standards for conduct than US law.

And I will restate my particular beef with this individual, that warming up people off the grounds for classes at shows and similarly thwarting the spirit if not the absolute letter of the suspension leaves me rather skeptical about any level of remorse.

[War_Admiral]

Haha, y’all are QUICK!!! Congrats to Lori B. for being our first signer!!

It crossed my mind that Yours Idiotically had not yet renewed her membership and I didn’t want to sign until I was active again, so I’m #7.

Now it’s up to y’all to get this thing circulating throughtout the equestrian community. Many, many thanks for your support.

[harryjohnson_Aefvue]

Midge, I have signed the petition, I am not a USEF member so I have no idea if it will have any bearing. I have also brought it to the attention of all of the people where my wife rides, lesson children included, along with a description of what happened at the time.

[shade]

WA the shirts are great…great variety also. Thanks to both WA and Snowy for all their efforts.