THE suspension list

[CBoylen]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pinkhorse:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by C.Boylen:
And the point to all this is that NO ONE saddles up to come in second. You can’t legislate that<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

OMG - join the real world!!! I guess I just hang out with lots of NO ONEs. We can’t all own lots of horses “of the century”. Some of us ride to ride and show to ride. Some of us get our satisfaction from the horse.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That’s lovely Pinkhorse, but we aren’t discussing you and your friends. We’re also not discussing ME, so there’s no need to be quite so rude. The whole reason anyone is talking about any of these issues is because we’re discussing high profile trainers. No one cared when they didn’t recognize names on the suspension list Everyone gets satisfaction from their horses, and of course there are people that show for fun. There are also people that show to suceed at this sport, and spend a lot of time and money doing so. There are people that make their living off this sport. Those are the people we are discussing, and they set out every day to win, because there is a lot on the line. I don’t imagine they are the only ones that enjoy winning, otherwise all shows would give everyone the same color ribbon.

http://community.webshots.com/user/anallie

[Tackpud]

Thanks Kinsella. My copy won’t be here for at least another month - for some reason it takes forever to get to Chatham. Reserpine rears its head again - I thought everyone knew about that stuff by now…

[bluemoonfarms]

quote

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Originally posted by Magnolia

I got a copy of a quarter horse magazine the other day - one field of competition where horses are bred and manipulated to be unnatural. The reining, pleasure and contest horses were cute and attractive. The “manipulated” halter ones were bizarre looking - tiny feet, tiny heads, bulbous bodies - just UGLY. They were caricatures of horses.

Is the same thing happening in hunters? We create little robots that lifelessly pack around. When will that start looking bad and unnatural to people?

BTW, I think the top horses put in smooth performances but keep a spark - that is what is so rare.

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I can show you what type of hunter I am breeding. My website is currently being redone so go to http://www.rockymountainwarmblood.com/pik-offspring.html and look at Persuasion and Pik Sure then go to http://www.bluemoonfarms.net/mares.html and see the dams Ontarla and Donata. Ontarla was even in foal to Persuasion when the pic was taken. Another pic of Pik Sure is at http://www.bluemoonfarms.net/progeny.html None of these horses are offered for sale and these mares can go in the ring without any drugs and just light schooling. I am hopeful that their offspring will be the same and they sure seem to have the temperament to do so thus far. The young geldings have been shown in hand at young ages to get them accustomed to being on the show grounds at an early age. Pik Sure is just now lightly started under saddle and has great ridablility and a very easy way of going thus far. I have high hopes for both of these guys and only time will tell. These boys are by no means dull but both have inherited good sensible heads from both parents. Trying to fit a square peg into a round hole just doesn’t cut it but with the right breedings and correct upbringing I see no reason why hunters can’t be bred successfully.

Denise Higgins www.bluemoonfarms.net
Domestic & Imported Warmbloods

[findeight]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ash:

Didn’t changing the specs in the Western Pleasure division help that discipline do away with a lot of the crazy things people used to do to make their horses carry their heads so low?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why yes. The rule that the poll must be no lower then the withers has resulted in a new conformation chart officially renaming the knees as “withers”.

No doubt changing the Hunter judging rules will have a similar beneficial effect.

Actually the so called “rules” are pretty general and leave alot up to the person doing the judging.

Most of what some posters are objecting to is NOT anything written in any rulebook.

The Horse World. 2 people, 3 opinions. That’s the way it is.

[WIndward_1998]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CTT:
who knows what some of these people are on the list for but the easiest way is not to pay your show bill. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They always explain the reason for the suspension in the Horse Show Mag. It should make for some interesting reading in the next issue.

Two minutes to Glory, hoping the judge isn’t blind.

[Tiramit]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Portia:
If you had been at the D&M open forum at the Annual Meeting last year and heard Dr. Allen’s and Dr. Lengel’s reports on what their studies of Dex usage revealed, and the myriad problems overuse can cause – systemic failures going far beyond founder – I don’t think you would be as cavalier about injecting it into your horse regularly as you seem to be from your comments here. (At least, I hope you wouldn’t be.)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Portia, are the minutes from this forum available to the public? I’d like to read them…

…
“Whether you think you can or think you can’t - you are right.” -Henry Ford

[Linus]

A few questions. I’m sure my ignorance is showing, but how exactly is intent determined in the suspension process? If an “incident” is found to be accidental (wrong feed bucket, for instance), does that weigh into the severity of the punishment?

[lucky2day99]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DMK:
technically speaking, I think they can still bounce on your head with reserpine. I’ll stick with dormosedan for clip jobs, thank you very much!

“I used to care, but things have changed…” Bob Dylan<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

laughs You know all of the horses needed to have treatment for high blood pressure… or maybe some horseys had too many mental issues.

Christina

[Ghazzu]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by khobstetter:
I thought Reserpine was injectable only???
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

It comes in an oral form, as well.

Unashamed member of the Arab clique…just settin’ on the Group W bench.

[flshgordon]

I guess maybe I am the only one that doesn’t understand the politics involved in this testing, because I just DO NOT understand how it costs $350 to $600 PER HORSE to drug test a horse!!! Doesn’t anyone else find this to be an absurd figure? Draw blood/collect urine and then send it off to the lab–how does the bill get up to hundreds of dollars?

I’m not saying I won’t pay extra fees at shows, but if they’re going to triple+ my cost of testing fees from $10 to $35 they damn well better be able to say they are getting the problem under control for that figure and making it fair for those of us who actually try to work with our horses instead of drugging them into submission.

“Half the failures in life arise from pulling in one’s horse as he is leaping”

[Janet]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> My understanding is that a vet suggested the use of X drug for a specific medical condition, told the trainers that they could show the horse again in X days, as it was “not testable” at that point. However, that time frame was not correct, hence the positive tests. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>If they were, in fact, giving it for therapeutic purposes, then they should have filed a D&M form. (If they had, it would have been noted in the published suspension report. It wasn’t on the ones that have appeared so far, we will have to wait for the next issue to seea bout the new ones.)

I am also curious as to what sort of “medical condition” warranted a therapeutic treatment that included reserpine.

Janet
chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle, and Brain

[QueenMother]

Where does the term “set down” come from? I understand “penalized,” “suspended,” "expelled."But I don’t think I’ve heard “set down” except in the context of punishing horse people (and I hear it in this context often.)
Can someone explain?

[dab]

Trying to show a suspended horse under a different name would be a violation – I would hope that someone would notice, and there would be an additional suspension given to the people involved –

There is a post of a USAE hearing result on the American Morgan Horse Association site – I don’t know the details of the case (only found it by searching on a name recently added to the USAE suspension list) – The hearing found that this Morgan owner was trying to misrepresent one horse as another (I assume it involved showing the horse - How else would USAE become involved? – But, that’s not clear from reading the report) –

I did appreciate being able to find the USAE hearing report online – Would be nice if this was done on the USAE site –

[Janet]

Yes, but I was commenting on the statement that
“the horse wouldn’t have performed as well without the help…”

Janet
chief feeder and mucker for Music, Spy, Belle, and Brain

[Dana]

Lord Helpus, I love the “theory” behind your suggestion, but I have serious doubts as to whether it would really be enforcable. With the lax way AHSA (USAE, USAF or whatever else they are calling themselves today) enforce horse registrations and with no permanent way to identify registered horses, it’s just too easy to sell the “scarlet letter” horse to the other side of the country and change it’s name and re-register it with AHSA. Until they implement some type of permanent identification on horses (tattoo, picture of markings on registration, etc.) and SOMEONE actually makes sure the registered horse MATCHES the one going into the ring, this is going to continue to be a problem. Just MHO

Dana

Friends don’t let friends ride junk!

[Roisin]

Like Flashy Gray said…what is “it” (the drug or drugs) that is causing the suspensions? Is it something new or something already on the banned list?

Or is “it” something else???

[stop4]

Is there anyone here besides me who thinks that the majority of show horses aren’t being drugged? It sounds like most of you think that top horses are drugged… am I jsut misunderstanding you? Threads like this bring a lot of bad publicity about a very very small group in the sport. Maybe I’m just not cynical enough to fit in on this board…

Marion
Amalia

[Won2Keep]

I have a novel idea.

Why don’t we as consumers take our money elsewhere? When you trainer is drugging horses, leave. Go somewhere else. When a trainer is suspended, don’t take lessons, don’t ride with this person, don’t buy horses from this person (PV comes to mind).

Instead of letting the USEq do all the dirty work, we as paying customers should black ball repeated offenders. Instead of talking with your mouth, talk with your money.

[Dana]

So, there would be like needle and syringe police at the shows? Doesn’t sound logical to me. Certain people just snooping around the barns to see if a certain trainer had the illegal stuff around his barn? They sure couldn’t (I wouldn’t think) be able to go through all the trunks and chests in the set up.

How would they even police this? It’s not like most people drag their horses out into the middle of the aisle to give an injection.

Dana

Friends don’t let friends ride junk!

[mcd]

Perhaps the students of suspended trainers (a) truly believe they are innocent or (b) care too much about the ribbons they are winning with their quiet horses to wonder or care how they got that quiet in the first place? In my mind it’s sort of the same as lungeing for hours on end - a means to an end, that’s all. In the same vein, and I don’t want to start a huge flame throwing match or re-ignite a topic that has been beaten to death so to speak, but I don’t really see how students could stay with a particular trainer after said trainer had been kicked off a couple of Olympic squads for cocaine (alleged? cocaine?) use but they all stayed and probably kept winning. It just leaves a bad taste in my mouth, IMHO.

• mcd.