If you look at any of my posts you will see at no time I commend or applaud the anorexic rider. I am an advocate of “fit horse, fit rider”, suitability to count and the education of horsemanship. All of it, not just the part that seems to suit people and what they are choosing to accomplish. It is an everyday learning experience.
I have a feeling that I am going to get slammed pretty hard here, but I really feel that I must say something in response to all of this. I will try my best not to cause any offense or be misinterpretted… but we’ll see.
Everyone knows that talent is not enough to win you a blue ribbon in the hunters or the equitation. It certainly is a most necesary ingredient, but there ARE other components, as so many of us are all too painfully aware. Like it or not, we ARE judged on how we appear. Our aesthetic value is of great importance inside the showring, and no type of rule will ever change that, nor should it.
As a lover of perfection, I think one of the most beautiful things in the world to watch is a perfectly executed hunter/equitation round. There is just such an inherent beauty in a flawless trip, where the rider and the horse work together as one machine instead of two, uniting to embody grace, majesty, and pure loveliness. Say, in a particular equitation class, two riders achieve the great feat of executing a flawless round (“flawless” is a subjective adjective, of course, and so I would therefor encourage the reader to conjure his or her own image of what a “flawless round” is). These two riders had trips of the same caliber. Say that these riders are girls of the same age and that they are equally well mounted. Girl A, however is 5’9" and 135 pounds, while Girl B is 5"4 and the same weight. If I were judging the class, Girl A would win. Does that make me a horrible person? What can I do to change the fact that I would have the thinner girl win? I can not help it, a tall and slim girl will always seem more attractive to me on horseback than a girl carrying more weight. There is no happy solution either, because you know what? If a judge in the above situation was thin and pinned the thin girl first, then people would say that he/she was disgusted by larger girls. And if the judge was heavy and he/she awarded the larger girl the victory, then the people would only say that the judge did it because he/she wanted the larger girl to beat the slimmer one.
You can have a horse groomed to perfection and in glorious shape, but if you put an unattractive rider aboard it takes away from the picture. I wish that this was not a truth, but undeniably, it is. As this thread so clearly demonstrates, few of us have not had to witness the mentality of “thinner is more attractive” in the horseshow world at nearly every turn. I am, perhaps, a cruel pessimist, but this mentality is going nowhere and is unshakable. Nothing can be done, so we must all cope.
I am slender and tall now (at 19), and I eat like its going out of style, but I am no fool. I know that it will all most likely catch up to me in due time. I will fight off that day, but when it does eventually come, I can only hope to accept it and move on. If a thinner girl beats me to a ribbon that I once would have gotten in my more slender days, than so it is. I will look at that person and know that it is a more pleasant experience for the judge to watch her go around than me. I will look at that person just as I looked at the girls who beat me in my junior days who could afford nicer horses and more time riding instead of working. I envied those girls, sure, but they WERE better in the ring, how could I fault them for that? Life is most certainly not fair, but as long as I am trying my best and having my fun, who cares? I love my horses and I love this sport with all of my being… and that is what I let count. If you need to win or even place high to proove yourself and feel good, then so be it. But you won’t catch me feeling that way. There are much better ways for me to proove myself. If it is your weight that is getting in the way of winning for you then that it is extremely unfortunate, but something that only weight loss will change. Don’t let politics and personal opinions take away from the sport… those aspects are here to stay. You are left to love this whole silly thing that we all do for its thousands of other splendors… if you are unable to appreciate that then there is really no use in spending all of the money required in this sport… I suggest you pick up tennis or piano.
Kelsy I admire you for posting that…I can totaly relate b/c that’s how it is for me - in addition to the fact that I am very compulsive and perfectionist about things - I can’t ‘just diet’ either I eat or I don’t and it kinda sux.
I really wish you didn’t feel that way - I really wish weight wasn’t an issue - I really wish I didn’t skip meals and obsess over what I ate. I really wish our society didn’t judge people on weight - b/c that is where this all comes from - it’s not really a riding issue per say b/c this exists everywhere - it’s a people issue and it’s about accepting one another and yourself.
As for me I say all this, I know all this, but I’m still fighting my own battle. A few weeks ago I had an assignment for a class to write down everything I ate for a weekend - and you know what I couldn’t do it b/c I couldn’t bare to look at that list - I just couldn’t. Even being my third year of ‘recovery’ it is just to hard sometimes. There are days when I physically ‘cannot’ eat. But those days are fewer and fewer.
This is something many juniors (and others as well face) and they should not be being told by judges or others to lose weight. I hope all you trainers and parents support your kids and DON’T yell at them about weight - trust me it doesn’t help anything at all.
Sarah
Wow, I am really glad I event and do jumpers and dressage. I have never been a skinny person. I have an hourglass figure and yes, I do carry extra weight. But most of me is muscle, I am on a syncronized swim team at school. When I first started riding I had the owner of the H/J barn tell me that if I lost 15 lbs. I could ride the best horse in the barn at the shows that season. I was crushed and didn’t lose the weight. B/C I didn’t lose the weight I had to ride the worst horse in the whole place. The owner of the facility said that b/c of my size I was the only person able to ride that horse (a draught cross). She got to chose who rode which horse, instead of the trainer making these decisions. She said that all the other riders were to small to handle him. They always stuck me with the hard horses b/c I had so much muscle that I was able to get them around any course. It made me a much better rider but I never won anything.
When I hit puberty I got even curvier and a new trainer came into the barn. He told me during one lesson “we are going to have to do something with your chest. You are so large that the judges will be looking at your breasts so much they will miss the rest of your ride.” (I am a 34" D cup). I had to wear 2 bra’s, (1 with underwire, the other a sport bra), and get my mother to wrap my chest with a standing wrap and duct tape, during shows. Then there was no movement to distract the judge. I laugh about it now but back then it was really embarassing!
I went to a couple horse trials to check them out and after getting to know the riders, trainers, and judges, I decided that I belonged there more then in the H/J ring. My parents didn’t have much money so I couldn’t afford the nice horses, nice clothes, and lessons from the best trainers. I went on to compete my horse in the Intermediate young rider championships and was quite sucessful. I have won many awards for eventing, dressage, and jumpers.
It’s really to bad that the hunter judges can’t see beyond the look. People that are overweight can still be very athletic. Trust me, I am. If a swim team let’s me compete for their team, why wouldn’t I win in a hunter ring?
Where is Heidi Robiani (sp?) when we need her???
Chief, you sound like you have a great figure. If anyone gives you flack, strip nekkid and ask them where you are to loose weight.
5 lbs? 5…I’m stumped - how and where did she see this awful blemish of 5 whole lbs? Noticing 50 I can see but 5 - bite me. And another thing - I didn’t know that only skinny people were allowed to ride; so I guess that counts me and my big ol’ flabby booty out. Glasgow - I love what you had to say - what a picture - LOL!!
I can’t get over people’s obseesion with thin is good. Like the skinnies here (I mean that nicely) have discovered - thin doesn’t always mean good or healthy. I am appalled by that heartless judge and all the other heartless judges, trainers, etc that think they have to crush dreams because you don’t fit their accepted little mold. My best friend is heavy and she is an awesome rider - so light and graceful, clinicians rave about her. Even skinnies ride like clumps ( I am one of them but I’m trying to fix that =)).
That would be about 300 lbs for the average warmblood or big TB of 1200 lbs…But…I need to start up on the saddle issue again…(sorry but it is germain)…those QHs can carry those big men because their saddles spread their weight over a greater surface area of their backs which protects the back from deep spots and or pressure points…alot of weight pressing on say 300 (or so) square inches of saddle area (small prix type saddle) can feel alot more uncomfortable than that same weight spread over roughly 900 square inches of stock saddle. That’s why saddle fit is crucial to performance. Sorry to start the “saddle thing” again. 
Thank you Nora! I’m the same way, and I too attempted to starve myself into that ideal build, which of course I’m not physically capable of having. Your post was definately not pointless, it’s nice to see that I’m not the only one out there who’s still fighting it!
I think it is disgusting to see mostly skinny riders in the equitation.I am glad if you are just naturally skinny,God gave you that right,but people who starve themsleves to death just for the blue ribbon(most of the time there is no cash profit!)should not be able to ride horses!It is dangerous to be too skinny,you usually lose muscle and then you want to sit on a 1,500+lb animal,give me a break,you can be seriously injured if not killed!I feel sorry for those judges who can do nothing but sit on their butt and judge people how they look and by how they ride, they shouldn’t even be called judges but they could be called monsters!I am not from a family blessed with being skinny,but the far oppisite.I have worked hard not to be overweight and I think that if I ride well,screw the judges that think otherwise!I asked to look at the judges score cards once and the girl who got first every time had a lot more faults than I did(and more than other riders as well),so I asked why I placed 2nd behind her in my classes if I scored better and he told me that I didn’t fit his "perfect-rider"desciption.So I told all my friends and now we don’t go to any shows that have him judging(we have complained to show management also),the result-he no longer judges any more of these shows!We as a whole need to let our voices be heard,equestraian sports are headed to bad times if this "skinny"trend doen’t stop!!
Hey Cosmo,
It sounds to me that, in reality, you know that you are healthy and fit and that you should ignore uninformed comments from others. If you feel good, ride well, and are athletically sound, weight is a nonissue. Make your decisions about healthy diet and exercise based on how you FEEL. You are, after all, first and foremost an athlete. You’ll be the best rider you can be by focusing on your athleticism and forgetting about ignorant remarks made by anyone.
I feel deeply for the young woman involved in that horse show. How ignorant of that judge. PLEASE write a letter, not only to that judge, but forward a cc to the AHSA and the Intercollegiate Association. I would not be afraid to mention his/her name either. Alot of us on this board and others run horse shows and I certainly would NOT want anyone like that destroying the self esteem of my clients and coustomers. If I heard that comment I would have addressed it immediately AND involved the Horse show manager and the president (or equivalent) and had it out right then and there…(privately of course so as NOT to embarrass the rider any further)That is so sad that in this day and age of tolerance and celebration of diversity that someones weight (or the lack thereof in some cases) still is the basis for open and hostile commentary by all those that percieve themselves as “holier than thou”.
I too hope trainers register this cause its not a funy issue and sometimes it can be deadly. I was lucky to live but what about the next girl. I feel we need to do something about this. Anyone have any ideas. Hey I just thought about something (just this moment) Why not start a posative body image campaighn. Ok I sound insane but I feel that people like me need to do something about this problem. Its not OK for riders to think they half to be in a body image rhelm. Its unhealthy and it causes perminate damage. People nead to see the afects of all of this. Only till someone comes upp with a way to stop this our future riders will continue to be drilled that they half to live this image life. IT NEEDS TO STOP NOW! We need to do something to preserve our future. We need to let riders know its ok to eat but its not OK to force them selves to vomit, starve thamselves, use un necasary drugs, smoke ( well i shouldn’t be talking but yesterday, sory I half to share this cause Im so proud of myself but I have started the first steps to quiting. This is a big step for me and I wish more kids would folow me in this cause I realized its sick and I want to stop), and what ever else they do these days. I wish trainers would stop this cause its not them thats going to get hurt in the long run its the people who are doing what they ask. Ok now that I got this out f my system I realized I have now a nother project to work on. Any one interested in joining me to stop this before its too late. e-mail me please
The place for this discussion would be at the various judge’s clinics. Therefore, aside from sending a letter to the judge you send your mail to the Licensed Officials Committee.
If it were one of my kids, and I mean students too. That judge would receive a very direct letter from me. And, I wish that judge has a problem of over weight before she goes out of this world so she will understand how it feels.
I happened to have been one of the skinny ones even though I ate enough for a 300 pound football player. I spent most of my early years trying to put weight on. After the middle years it went into reverse. So, now I can sympathize with all of those who actually eat like a bird and put on a pound.
My two daughters were a classic example. My older daughter had the short leg and a chuky look even though she wasn’t at all chunky but muscled. She by the way wound up a National Champion in the IHSA. My youger daughter had the look. It was really amazing how much better the older girl had to be to even get looked at, and the younger would be forgiven major errors.
So, this campaign is not new to me. PLEASE! send your thoughts by email to the Licensed Officials committee for the instruction of the judges. We may by that means be able to save not only many good riders who don’t have the look but many young girls who become ill and are injured because they have the look.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Portia:
[B]Article 2208. Position.
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General. Rider should have a workmanlike appearance, seat and hands light and supple, conveying an impression of complete control should any emergency arise. …
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Hands. Hands should be over and in front of the horse’s withers, knuckles thirty degrees inside the vertical, hands slightly apart and making a straight line from the horse’s mouth to rider’s elbow. Method of holding reins is optional and bight of reins may fall on either side. However, all reins must be picked up at the same time.
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Basic Position. The eyes should be up and shoulders back. Toes should be at an angle best suited to rider’s conformation: ankles flexed in, heels down, calf of leg in contact with horse and slightly behind girth. Iron should be on the ball of the foot and must not be tied to the girth.
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Position in Motion. At the walk, sitting trot and canter, body should be a couple of degrees in front of the vertical; posting trot, inclined forward; galloping and jumping, same inclination as the posting trot.
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Mounting and Dismounting. To mount, take the reins in left hand and place hand on withers. Grasp stirrup leather with right hand and insert left foot in stirrup, toe in girth and mount. To dismount, rider may either step down or slide down. The size of rider must be taken into consideration.
Article 2209. Appointments.
- Personal. Exhibitors and judges should bear in mind at all times entries are being judged on ability rather than on personal attire. …
Those are the rules for hunter eq. Someone show us where it says in these standards: “Personal Appearance. Rider must be tall and slender.”
The only reference in the hunter eq rules to a rider’s size is that the judge the size has to be taken into account when mounting – meaning the judge should factor in that a kid who is 5’ tall will look awkward trying to mount somebody’s else’s 17 hand horse, regardless of how good a rider they are and not hold that against them. I realize that the tall and slender thing is ingrained in the minds of Eq judges, trainers, and riders, but someone ought to point out that it is not engrained in the rules.
[This message has been edited by Portia (edited 04-04-2000).][/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I really think some Judges need to go back to school, and study everything in these 2 articles. I the past 4 years of showing, I have been asked to dis-mount and re-mount only once, and that was in a pleasure class back in '97.
Although I am large, I am very mobile. I ride 3-4 horses a day, and none of them are “packers”. (I should be that luckly.) The most unfortuent part is that in the Hunters, it is NOT judged on MY performance. It is judged on my Horse’s. And like these articles state, the way of movement. Not on how skinny the rider is.
Unfortunetly, I can’t do my horse in Jumpers where we are not “judged”. She is too Hunter-typed to run. She is a pretty mover, and has a gorgeous front end when she jumps.
One different note here -
If the horse show industry/mindset is so obessed with being thin and slim - then why is almost all the food sold at shows really fatty?
As someone who doesn’t eat red meat or cheese or many other ‘fatty’ foods’ and usually restrains from junk food while competing I find it very hard to eat at shows
- if they’re all going to make us feel guilty for that hamburger/hot dog/bag of chips woudnl’t you think shows could find a way to sell sandwiches, salads, or lower fat snacks? I mean I know at big shows like Devon you can get anything but at most smaller shows even rateds there is hardly any food - if I can’t bring my own I usually can’t find something I feel like eating.
Thoughts?
Sarah
I did not mean to seem as if I were attacking you - but I really don’t think it makes a difference - ESPECIALLY from the horse’s view. A healthy horse can easily carry like 25% of it’s body weight. For example my 17 hand hunter weights (I’m guessing) maybe 1200 or so - so he could carry like 300 pounds right…alright that number may be a little high let’s say maybe like 250?? So if he could carry that why would it affect him if I was like 160 pounds instead of the 118 I am now? I don’t really think you can use the horse as the argument in most cases. YES, I am sure there are situations where are rider is physically to heavy for the horse but I don’t think that is the case in the majority of situations.
Ah … to be 19, tall and slim … and to know it all.
Kelsy-
Your post makes me so sad! Cigarettes are so awful. I just read Christy Turlington has emphysema! I bet she’d gain 10 lbs to lose that diesease, which will be with her forever.
Do yourself a favor. If you think you are too fat, have your body fat compostion measured. At 5’8, 140 lbs, unless you have absolutely no muscle (which is so very unlikely), you are probably pretty thin.
If you still feel the need to lose a few pounds, come up with a healthier method than smoking.
I feel bad for all of you juniors. I grew up fat, and am still fat (and I won my combined test this weekend!). I try my best and exercise, but it just sticks around. I have a sense of humor about it now, but the teen years were god awful.
The weight problem is definately a big issue with “children”, but it doesn’t just go away when they become “adults”…which makes this an even bigger problem.
I am 32 years old now - my weight problems started when I was 14-15 years old showing on the A circuit. I wasn’t skinny like the other girls…big issue…trainer said drop a few pounds… well, one thing lead to another, and anorexia set in several years later. I used to be a pretty good rider, but having lost 20+ pounds I turned into a space cadet that couldn’t concentrate or focus…I may have been skinny, but I didn’t win.
The weight issue has been with me ever since - it’s not something that you can just get rid of. Although I have learned to live a healthy life, it was not an easy road, and I am still overly concerned about my weight and appearance (5’3", 100lbs). I wouldn’t wish what I went through on anyone… not even my worst enemy. It is truly an all encompassing evil that tears you apart…and never really leaves.
I hope that people realize this and stop with the thinness pressure. It’s a nasty world out there, especially for “children”.
Regalmeans (Sarah),
You say you are 5’5" and 115 pounds? I’m 5’ and 113 pounds. Ypu, my friend, are NOT fat…Me on the other hand…I’m chubby. and not afraid to admit it. I could give a flying leadchange about what people think of my appearance. I care about what I think…not others.
Ryan
