Totilas is on Superior Equine at $7100 a dose.
[QUOTE=Donella;7165438]
I think it is 5k euro per dose which coverts to $6600.00 US per dose. Not sure where the 12 k came from?[/QUOTE]
Yes true for those of us on this side of the pond. Those that are in Germany the fee is 4000 Euro at time of breeding with another 4000 Euro due in October with confirmation of a pregnancy. So the stud fee is actually 8000 Euro which converts roughly to about $11000 USD, give or take, depending on the daily market.
I’m still of the opinion that his fee is yards too high. There are stallions who have actually been to the Olympics, even won medals at the Olympics and have lower stud fees. In addition some of those same stallions have been well proven in the breeding arena as well. The comment that he is the “best dressage horse in the world” is unfounded, IMO - he’s not the best horse on the planet until he’s won an Olympic Gold Medal! Until then, he belongs to an elite group of horses that are considered among the best dressage horses in the world. And even with all of that, he is still relatively unproven in the breeding shed until he proves he can produce stallion sons and Elite/Premium or State Premium mares and/or Bundeschampionat qualified youngsters or champions under saddle.
Breeders from Europe have told me that breeding to Totilas they have found tough because he tends to not be reproducing himself in type and movement, but most of the time the foals come out after the mare.
[QUOTE=Formosus;7165366]
I don’t think T’s stud fee is $12K:eek:
I thought it was very steeply priced at $5-6K/dose.[/QUOTE]
One of our German COTH members quoted the $12k stud fee, although I guess she didn’t look at the current conversion of E to $$. Over in Europe, as noted, it’s E4000 down and E4000 when the mare is confirmed in foal.
Assuming the breeders of the foals in the American auction bought the frozen for $7K and were lucky enough to get a pregnancy 1st cycle; then paid some $1000 in vet bills + another $2000 to keep the mare/foal till weaning, they made $5K (minus what they had to pay the auction house + the expense of getting the foal there in the first place).
Now, lets’ say the breeder of the Licotus filly paid $750 per dose, got a pregnancy 1st cycle and had the same expenses. They made $3500 on that foal.
Not much of a difference is it?
Both my Totilas fillies, Inaya NSN (foal) and Hosanna NSN (yearling) received their First Premiums from the KWPN-NA jury, with comments on their type, suppleness and great use of hind leg. While they are obviously influenced by their elite Ferro x Wanroij dam, Totilas improved the shoulder and added more suppleness. IMO, Totilas needs to be crossed to a mare with blood (th).
Maybe it’s just my OCD, but the name of this thread is driving me crazy! lol The OP needs to correct his name in the subject line. 
Found this video . . . 2011 Totilas - Sir Donnerhall - filmed at 2+ years old
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SB0O9sqJtuY
Interesting to see. Thought you guys might enjoy. Maybe an idea as to what he is producing conformationally and movement wise . . . obviously only one example but one of the first videos I have seen of a Totilas baby older than a weanling or yearling.
Kim
I don’t know if Totilas is a great one or not, but there are many great horses that never win and or even compete at the Olympics --luck and good timing along with talent is required to win one of those.
The Totilas / Sir Donnerhall colt is beautiful! But is it Totilas or Sir Donnerhall shining through? or some of each? From what I’ve seen, in person and on videos, the dam seems to have the big influence most often. Given that T has been bred to generally superior dams, I would have expected more quality, more often. In my opinion he is not a stamper. I do think a leggy blood-influenced mare might be a good gamble, but I would not use Totilas unless I thought it was a perfect match - even without the black coat and the hype. Personally, I do not have a mare whom I consider a good match, so I need not struggle with any temptation.
I think that Totilas/Sir Donnerhall colt is the same one I have heard about - Totilas / Sir Donnerhall I / Rubinstein I. My understanding is he is being marketed as a stallion candidate and since the horse in the video certainly knows how to show in hand, it appears they have the stallion selections in mind. It will be interesting to see if he is on the selection list.
I am also keen to see some older Totos.
I found this foal on youtube too, similarly bred. Very flashy fellow. I rather prefer the recipient mare over the dam though! I suppose as far as epigenetics go that may be no bad thing, the best of both worlds perhaps?
[QUOTE=Kerole;7173320]
I am also keen to see some older Totos.
I found this foal on youtube too, similarly bred. Very flashy fellow. I rather prefer the recipient mare over the dam though! I suppose as far as epigenetics go that may be no bad thing, the best of both worlds perhaps?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1ORzClxl1Q[/QUOTE]
I have to say, what a great video! Beautifully done - gorgeous backgrounds and colors - just a pleasure to watch. And of course a nice foal too! (albeit I am not a huge fan of the large white facial markings, it’s a very flashy colt!)
[QUOTE=Kerole;7173320]
I am also keen to see some older Totos.
I found this foal on youtube too, similarly bred. Very flashy fellow. I rather prefer the recipient mare over the dam though! I suppose as far as epigenetics go that may be no bad thing, the best of both worlds perhaps?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1ORzClxl1Q[/QUOTE]
I’m sorry – but I am not wowed by this colt. Flashy markings, yes. He’s a very nice colt, sure…but in terms of movement, I have a Soprano/Weltmeyer filly that I video taped at the same age (she was 32 days old vs 28 days for the chestnut colt) who is the better mover by far.
You can find the video on this board under “Rainy Day Filly.”
I don’t think I’m being barn blind here, since the said filly (now 2.5 mos old) just won her inspection & scored 8.6 in movement.
The dam is not near the quality of the one shown in the chestnut colt’s video, yet look at what Soprano improved! In terms of a sire, it would appear Soprano is far superior…and he doesn’t cost and arm & a leg.
It said this foal was accepted into one of the Elite auctions…any idea how much he went for?
[QUOTE=kdavies;7173500]
Totilas - Sandro Hit mare (born 2011)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENXBU_nmTdk[/QUOTE]
Flashy! … but I see more Sandro Hit than Totilas. Of course, I wouldn’t kick her out of bed for eating crackers.
Totilas - Sandro Hit mare (born 2011)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENXBU_nmTdk
Love the trot but am not so keen on the shape of this mare, she lacks a bit of substance and her hind end looks a bit underdone. I see more SH in her looks than T.
Kyzteke, I couldn’t agree more. I think the colt is very nice but not an OMG mover.
In this vid he has shed out dark, shiny liver. He is super impressive in looks but his trot is even more average in this vid. LOVE his looks though!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAZRENL5wME
Sadly I could sell this colt a thousand times over, a much easier sale than a better moving, non-T, plainer coloured foal.
Agree with Kerole ^^ chrome is king! :rolleyes:
The colt (in his inspection video) is breathtakingly gorgeous–just. Wow. Much more impressive than in the earlier video of him at a month old, and such a rare color!, here I was thinking he might wind up grey? from the dam. I’m with kdavies in not personally liking the “bald face”, but he gets away with it by virtue of his elegant neck and his lovely head.
How did he wind up with SO much chrome? It looks like the Sabino gene (but from whom?)
I agree that his movement is not “all that”, he seems to lack reach through the shoulder, ground cover, true suspension and push from the hind end. His dam seems to have flatter (more huntery) but more ground covering movement.
Is Totilas CAPABLE of throwing his movement?? How many mares has he been bred to?
The dark bay filly is SO elegant!, another one with a beauteous head, but she seems very light-boned. It will be interesting to see how much she fills out (and since when is a horse a “mare” when it’s only 2?)
Interesting thread! I guess it “remains to be seen” as to how he will be ultimately be judged as a sire; as everyone has pointed out, he is bred to pretty much only the best mares. He has yet to produce something as nice as he is, or–is this not the ultimate test of sires?–produce a number of offspring who are at least as good or BETTER (than both parents) from a variety of different mares.
Not to say that his foals aren’t eye candy
[QUOTE=Kerole;7173542]
Love the trot but am not so keen on the shape of this mare, she lacks a bit of substance and her hind end looks a bit underdone. I see more SH in her looks than T.[/QUOTE]
Yep, I agree.
And an irrelevant comment . . . . What’s going on with her braids? I would have thought Paul S. could afford a good (if not super) experienced braider! Lol. Just a silly comment . . . . maybe her mane was rubbed out a bit or something . . . but those braids look all over the place . .
[QUOTE=Kyzteke;7173493]
I’m sorry – but I am not wowed by this colt. Flashy markings, yes. He’s a very nice colt, sure…but in terms of movement, I have a Soprano/Weltmeyer filly that I video taped at the same age (she was 32 days old vs 28 days for the chestnut colt) who is the better mover by far.
You can find the video on this board under “Rainy Day Filly.”
I don’t think I’m being barn blind here, since the said filly (now 2.5 mos old) just won her inspection & scored 8.6 in movement.
The dam is not near the quality of the one shown in the chestnut colt’s video, yet look at what Soprano improved! In terms of a sire, it would appear Soprano is far superior…and he doesn’t cost and arm & a leg.
It said this foal was accepted into one of the Elite auctions…any idea how much he went for?[/QUOTE]
I actually think the Totilas colt looks lovely and I really like his pedigree as a whole. Is he the flashiest mover I have ever seen? No. Is ridiculously big movement the only thing I look at in a horse? No. I love his conformation, I love his substance, I think he will grow to be a powerhouse, he has very good mechanics and a real ‘look at me’ presence.
I think people just enjoy knocking the Totilas foals down because of the price of the service fees, but honestly Totilas himself has a good pedigree and lots of power … comparing your filly of completely different breeding just seems entirely pointless, nice though I am sure she is!
