[QUOTE=subk;6467223]
I doubt it. He’s probably thanking his lucky stars he got a very tired and inexperienced horse home and didn’t take a header on the last fence that he puked over. Come the jog in the morning he might be wishing for a few more time penalties![/QUOTE]
There is that. I thought it was amazing that he got that horse around at that time and so near the top of the rank. I hope he passes the jog tomorrow.
Really? Well, poop.
I mean I knew it was a temporary course created for the Games and would go away, but c’mon, for the people who didn’t get around, or for other horses who are there (like Neville, for instance), or for the Japanese and Canadian teams - why can’t they have a school there before it all comes down?
I’m not at all against a healthy discussion/debate but… enough with the harsh criticism & myriad of “what-ifs”. It makes me sad. :no:
No one knows what might have happened if other riders & horses were chosen for the team… it could have been better, the same or WORSE!!
How about we just applaud our US team?! Stand behind them and support them… Give them credit where credit is due! I think they did great! Tiana rode like crazy… I was impressed & so happy that they made it around. Will had a great XC round with the exception of that unlucky stop at the bank. The others went clear! Yes, it would have been better if everyone was clear but that, I think, is highly unlikely for the Olympics… I mean look at what has happened to some of our veteran, “clutch” riders at past Olympics. No one is safe :yes:
I applaud them for their hard work & good riding! I am happy for all of them & will root them all on til it’s over 
Somehow the “please change the rules because we are not very good in dressage” argument is not a very classy one.
Perhaps we should get better in dressage, so we won’t need to have the rules changed so we can be competitive. 
[QUOTE=Anne FS;6467234]
I mean I knew it was a temporary course created for the Games and would go away, but c’mon, for the people who didn’t get around, or for other horses who are there (like Neville, for instance), or for the Japanese and Canadian teams - why can’t they have a school there before it all comes down?[/QUOTE]
Because they wouldn’t want too?
RaeHughes–Changes in format weren’t “all in the name of safety.” They were solely to keep the sport in the Olympics. Issue was the amount of open space required. Even Saint James the Woff now regrets his support of that change.
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;6467240]
Somehow the “please change the rules because we are not very good in dressage” argument is not a very classy one.
Perhaps we should get better in dressage, so we won’t need to have the rules changed so we can be competative. ;)[/QUOTE]
I agree…
I do not understand the crusade to get rid of the co-efficent. It only seems to be a problem when it is NOT working for who ever is complaining about it.
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;6467240]
Somehow the “please change the rules because we are not very good in dressage” argument is not a very classy one.
Perhaps we should get better in dressage, so we won’t need to have the rules changed so we can be competitive. ;)[/QUOTE]
Ummm…and getting rid of the long format wasn’t a “please change the rules because we are not very good on XC?”
All viney is trying to do is show how keeping the co-effiecnt when the rules WERE changed has lead to some unintended consequences and an even heavier weighting of dressage.
[QUOTE=subk;6467176
The first place horse may have scored in the 30s for dressage, but it will be a major shocker for everyone including Ingrid if she doesn’t add a couple rails to that score. Today you think she is a star because her dressage is great, but your view of her is not complete.
l.[/QUOTE]
First place HorseS. There two…tied…with sub 40. And unlike Ingrid’s horse…Wega I believe is a good SJ horse.
We only had two riders out of 5 get sub 50. And none made time. We left way too many points on the table. We did do well in that we didn’t leave more…but with the absolute outstanding level of competition, you can’t leave anything on the table.
I personally do think things will change around a lot tomorrow but perhaps not enough to change the US’s standings (although it is possible–we do have good jumpers). Today’s sport needs 3 very good phases.
I do think the US did well. I thought all rode xc very well…even Will and Tiana should be proud. We do need to up our game but in all honesty…I don’t think we even preformed below expectations. They did about as well as I expected. What I want to do is raise our expectations for WEG 2014…and Rio 2016…and I think that has already happened. These riders and some of the many great ones we have at home will be very motivated…
[QUOTE=subk;6467254]
Because they wouldn’t want too?[/QUOTE]
You think they wouldn’t want to? I’m thinking of the Japanese rider who fell before they rode into the arena for the Tower of London jump, so he didn’t even get past Fence 14. Don’t you think he would love to take his horse over the rest of the course? What an education.
[QUOTE=Anne FS;6467270]
You think they wouldn’t want to? I’m thinking of the Japanese rider who fell before they rode into the arena for the Tower of London jump, so he didn’t even get past Fence 14. Don’t you think he would love to take his horse over the rest of the course? What an education.[/QUOTE]
Nope I don’t think he would. It’s not how UL horses are schooled and for good reason.
[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;6467269]
First place HorseS. There two…tied…with sub 40. And unlike Ingrid’s horse…Wega I believe is a good SJ horse.[/QUOTE]
Wega’s never done a four star.
+1
I was also thinking of the riders’ education. The opportunity for that Japanese team to ride over that course could be invaluable.
The team did not perform below expectations, in my mind it performed exactly where I expected - mid-pack. We are good enough to get a full team around the cross-country course, but we are not good enough to be competitive for medals.
It is disappointing that the US used to be a powerhouse, always in contention team and now we are an average, middle of the road team. I am very much looking forward to an exciting finish between the Brits and Germans tomorrow, so it will be a great sporting event even with the US essentially out of contention.
We haven’t been out of the individual medals since 1992 (so getting an individual the last 4 games). And we had three games in a row in the team medals, but the 2008 games was the beginning of our slide, no team and Gina getting individual silver.
Other teams are improving and keeping up with international level competition while our team is either back-sliding or not keeping up. Maybe a new coach will be able to turn things around.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;6467153]
So why does not the US lobby for elimination of the dressage coefficient? It devalues both of the jumping phases. Why should dressage count so much in the 21st century. It and short format have changed the very type of horse used. Personally I think it makes XC more unsafe, since the horses are less suited and get more tired. This course was only 3 seconds off the absolute minimum length for a 4* and so many of the horses were struggling at the end.[/QUOTE]
Hear, hear! To do well in dressage, they need a heavier, WB-type. To get around CC in the time, they need a lighter, hot-blooded TB type. It just doesn’t seem fair. No wonder the TBs who ARE good at dressage (usually) do so well!
Personally, I was disappointed to see how many horses who were really out of gas at the end. Not the Brit horses, though - THEY all looked fine, except for Lionheart (he was raring to go at first and must have just used himself up). Is their training just better than ours???
OP again
[QUOTE=Carried Away;6467201]
I’m glad the OP has nothing else to say after starting this awful thread…from the looks of her other posts she’s a total DQ.
I for one am proud of our team, despite difficulties they did a great job and all of them came home safe & sound. Look at all the falls today! A few time penalties are nothing to make a big deal about, as other posters have said, it came down to having non-competitive dressage scores.
Tomorrow should be interesting![/QUOTE]
Not scared to post or admit I ride dressage now (FEI level) after years of eventing including FEI - but not 4*.
I changed “abysmal” - that was all very fair feedback. I tend to be dramatic in general. Sorry if that inflamed.
Anyway, my comment was as a spectator. I do not want to take away the hard work of the many people involved - riders and otherwise. I just wonder what we need to change to be more competitive.
Training? Breeding? US competitions - what would help in your opinions?
[QUOTE=Lord Helpus;6467240]
Somehow the “please change the rules because we are not very good in dressage” argument is not a very classy one.
Perhaps we should get better in dressage, so we won’t need to have the rules changed so we can be competative. ;)[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=subk;6467266]Ummm…and getting rid of the long format wasn’t a “please change the rules because we are not very good on XC?”
All viney is trying to do is show how keeping the co-effiecnt when the rules WERE changed has lead to some unintended consequences and an even heavier weighting of dressage.[/QUOTE]
I am in the “please change the rules, and bring back long format eventing” crowd. Bring back the endurance day – and the horses will change, as will the influence of the dressage phase.
I’d think Part of what’s tough about this course was that it was the Olympics- the course itself did not look terrible tough- I am not there, however. But the crowds and feeling of ‘olympic fever riding for the team’ would not be there if they schooled it later. JMHO
The footing looked tough in places- and of we want to talk about being dealt a crap hand, I’d think Clayton F gets that prize. Such a ‘freak’ thing from my vantage point at a Computer screen. I’m sure one could analize it and say what might have changed that outcome but it still sucked.
And now TC has done a big show and done well. Sure a stop is not what her aim was, but she will be another one to help field our next amazing team. Glad she and WC were there.
Sure wasn’t a total dressage show was it?
[QUOTE=subk;6467176]
I do agree that our dressage is not up to a top international level. No question. .[/QUOTE]
I agree, perhaps then CMP should have been sleeping with a dressage trainer as well? Seriously, it’s obvious our riders are just trying their hearts out. It’s not for lack of effort on their part, and I’m very proud of all of them. Leadership seems sadly lacking. We have a lame duck coach who has a rather mediocre OK record, and who frankly doesn’t seem able to really put it all together in spite of all the resources this country has to offer. In a sport that is so hugely mentally tough, I hope that DOC can lead, inspire, motivate and reinvigorate US Eventing. I hope CMP’s girlfriend has done a good job for our team, but no matter what, I’ll be cheering them on in SJ tomorrow.
[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;6467269]
I don’t think we even preformed below expectations. [/QUOTE]
I agree with this. Given that selection was not without internal disagreement, the reliance on relatively new mounts for experienced riders, and the realities of the competition records, I suspect the team’s performance was not unexpected at all.
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