Woman Shot at Barisone Farm

[farmpony84]

@sweet2lula

From the prosecutors office:

“At approximately 2:13 p.m. on August 7, police received a 9-1-1 call requesting service at 411 West Mill Road for a female with gunshot wounds. Washington Township Police responded to the scene and located one female who had sustained what appeared to be multiple gunshot wounds. The Defendant, Michael Barisone, and a second male victim were also located at the scene. A handgun was also recovered.

As a result of the investigation into this incident, the Defendant was charged with two counts of Attempted Murder, crimes of the first degree, and two counts of Possession of a Weapon for an Unlawful Purpose, crimes of the second degree.”

For those with knowledge of criminal law, does this (crimes of the first degree) indicate that the prosecutors office has evidence of premeditation, or does it mean something else? What about the weapons charges being of the second degree?

First degree murder is the most serious level. It would be things that are premeditated or intentional.

There was a case here a while back where a law enforcement official shot and killed his wife. He said she attacked him with a knife. He wasn’t injured, I think there may have been a scratch on him.

He did unload his gun on her but that would have been his training kicking in. He was obviously arrested and charged but as the investigation went on (he did lose his job), there was enough evidence found regarding her behavior and events leading up to the incident to dismiss the charges. (change them - I don’t remember if it was involuntary manslaughter or what it ended up being - but no jail time) I saw him coaching a rec basketball game not too long ago.

So these charges against Barisone may stick but since we don’t know exactly what happened they could end up being dropped or lessened, especially if they decide he did not show up there planning to shoot her. That “I had a good life” statement was odd and sounds like he knew he screwed up.

As for the gun - that will be interesting to find out if he brought it with him, took it from her, took it from the boyfriend etc. If the boyfriend is as shady as people on social media claim, it would be interesting to find out that he was actually outside when all this went down… (I’m not saying he was - just thinking this is definitely going to be an episode of Snapped when it is all said and done).

[farmpony84]

@enjoytheride

I don’t see anyone victim shaming. It’s just interesting to read her plotting to bring him down, saying she has evidence, knowing that there was an eviction notice on the house and she felt her life was in danger but refused to leave. It makes it sound like more than a clear cut “bully shoots accuser” situation.

I thought that about the “bully shoots accuser” when I saw the title to one of the news articles. It was something like “She said she feared for her life and five days later he shot her”…

[Toblersmom]

@Toblersmom

The Catch-22 about living someplace with a high right of gun crime and a high number of gun owners is that there are any number of settings where shooting somebody, with intent to kill them, is absolutely, positively, the only way to protect yourself and others. How many more people would have been killed and injured in Dayton, beyond the 10 dead and 27 injures, if he hadn’t been killed by officers within THIRTY SECONDS of starting to let it rip? How many more people would have died in Sutherland if Steve Willeford hadn’t shot him (acknowledging that Mr. Willeford did not succeed in killing the mass shooter, there’s no doubt he tried his very best to do so, and fortunately that was enough to make the shooter break off and stop.

And that’s not even counting the various victims of domestic violence or other crime where an attacker has a firearm and is showing real intention of using it to kill you. They just found the body of a woman who was almost certainly murdered by her own husband near where I live. The neighbohood of their home is very “nice”, at least as nice as my own. I don’t know whether or not she had the opportunity or the means to kill him first, but surely she would have been justified had she no other recourse and done so.

It’s nice that you apparently live in a place where having your life threatened by strangers isn’t all too commonplace. It’s nice that people around you are good people who wouldn’t even think of being a deadly threat. It’s nice that you can’t even begin to imagine being in a situation where you would be confronted with taking someone’s life to save your own or others. Enjoy it. Not everybody can say the same.

I feel the need to make it explicitly clear that my above response is in regards to the theory held by some that it is never morally or legally correct to kill somebody in self defense, full stop, or that there is always a way to defend yourself without using a gun or other fatal force.

I have every faith that the authorities entrusted with preservation of public safety and starting the wheels of justice rolling have acted appropriately in making this particular arrest, using these charges, and I think that the probability that some new information will come to light that he was truly acting in self-defense is vanishingly small.

[see_u_at_x]

@kcmel

Back in my hometown, a women pulled up to a guy in a parking lot, rolled down her window and shot him. Turned out he was molesting her niece. She never served a day.

Totally different from this situation, just pointing out that you can’t make that kind of statement as if it were fact.

Agreed. One of my ex-boyfriends drove 1,970 miles and crossed seven state lines to shoot his ex-wife’s new husband. (This happened years before we ever started dating, btw, and I did not know it until a few months into dating him.) The ex-wife had primary custody of their children and it turned out that the new husband was molesting all three of those kids. The judge in the prosecuting state ruled it a crime of passion. However, the judge also stated that what bothered him was that my ex had almost 2,000 miles and over 28 hours to think about what he was planning to do and to change his mind. My ex did not serve jail time, but was put on probation, moved to that state and was not allowed to leave the state except in the rare case of business travel or some sort of family emergency. Oh, and when he moved to that state, he then also got primary custody of his son and daughters, too.

There may not be anything on earth besides self-defense that justifies shooting another person, but I can see how extreme emotions can take hold and cause people to do regretful things. And I think that is one of the key words: regret. Regret and remorse. Does MB feel remorse for his actions? And not just because his career and life as he knows it might be ruined by this. Does he feel genuine remorse for shooting and hurting and almost killing another human being? I hope he does, and I hope for healing, both emotionally and physically, for everyone touched by this awful situation.

[DustBunny02]

Just chiming in re the social media being portrayed as fearing for her life, in one of the comments she said:

”it’s somewhat hilarious- but also possibly life threatening,- so…I guess I will laugh at the stupidity NOW- so I’m at least in hysterics when I get “whacked”.
I feel most sorry for whomever tries to bring me harm. Usually, people know better than to test me. This time, the lesson here will result in this: “ALWAYS, people know better than to test me!” (No more “usually’s”)

🤷”â™€ï¸

[ake987]

@DustBunny02

Just chiming in re the social media being portrayed as fearing for her life, in one of the comments she said:

”it’s somewhat hilarious- but also possibly life threatening,- so…I guess I will laugh at the stupidity NOW- so I’m at least in hysterics when I get “whacked”.
I feel most sorry for whomever tries to bring me harm. Usually, people know better than to test me. This time, the lesson here will result in this: “ALWAYS, people know better than to test me!” (No more “usually’s”)

🤷*♀️

:eek:

[Crashing_Boar]

One thing you NEVER hear mentioned in any of the news stories about these kinds of incidents or police-involved shootings, is that everyone involved is usually very HIGHLY ADRENALIZED. Your cerebral cortex is off-line, your brain stem, the reptillian survival part, is doing the processing. From the moment the sympathetic nervous system dumps the maximum adrenaline into your bloodstream, for all but the most highly trained, that equals one of 3 things, not under one’s control: Fight. Flight. Or Freeze. The most common is “freeze.”

The first thing to go is fine-motor control. One’s hands shake uncontrollably. Even speed-dialling a cell phone may take 6 tries. Cops are often found to have squeezed off 7 shots when they’d have sworn it was only 2. Time seems to move in slow motion, tunnel vision is common, and often one has no auditory recall of the experience.

Anyone who thinks they “know” how they’d react in such a situation is fooling themselves. Anyone who thinks their concealed (or open) Carry Permit is enough training to handle an active shooter is equally deluded. It’s not about the target practice, its about self-control when in mortal danger–as in someone shooting BACK. In the police and military, this is known as “agonistic training.” It is rigorous, unpleasant, absolutely necessary and frequently disturbing when you don’t react as you “think” you should.

Anyone who would like to believe they are minimally competent to control such a situation would be well advised to read Lt. Col. Dave Grossman’s classic book, On Combat. But there is no way you will ever truly understand unless such a situation (God forbid!) comes to YOU. Soldiers and cops know these things well, but never talk about it.

The bottom line is that “barn drama” should never, EVER, go this far. No “horse” problem is worth it. Period.

[AMWookey]

@Toblersmom

The Catch-22 about living someplace with a high right of gun crime and a high number of gun owners is that there are any number of settings where shooting somebody, with intent to kill them, is absolutely, positively, the only way to protect yourself and others. How many more people would have been killed and injured in Dayton, beyond the 10 dead and 27 injures, if he hadn’t been killed by officers within THIRTY SECONDS of starting to let it rip? How many more people would have died in Sutherland if Steve Willeford hadn’t shot him (acknowledging that Mr. Willeford did not succeed in killing the mass shooter, there’s no doubt he tried his very best to do so, and fortunately that was enough to make the shooter break off and stop.

And that’s not even counting the various victims of domestic violence or other crime where an attacker has a firearm and is showing real intention of using it to kill you. They just found the body of a woman who was almost certainly murdered by her own husband near where I live. The neighbohood of their home is very “nice”, at least as nice as my own. I don’t know whether or not she had the opportunity or the means to kill him first, but surely she would have been justified had she no other recourse and done so.

It’s nice that you apparently live in a place where having your life threatened by strangers isn’t all too commonplace. It’s nice that people around you are good people who wouldn’t even think of being a deadly threat. It’s nice that you can’t even begin to imagine being in a situation where you would be confronted with taking someone’s life to save your own or others. Enjoy it. Not everybody can say the same.

From what people have said about the area, it’s not one where people may fear for their lives.

And YES, people that live outside of the USA have a hard time grasping all of this. It’s never going to change. You cannot help but look at the high rate of gun crimes in the US, compared to any other 1st world country, and wonder about the correlation. you can’t help but look at situations such as these, and wonder about the outcome elsewhere. You cannot deny the facts that the US has the highest rate of gun related deaths compared to any other 1st world country. So yes, it is nice to live somewhere when it’s not as big as an issue, and the cavalier attitude towards guns stumps some of us.

And before the pro gun folks say “just because you are afraid of guns” I am actually quite confident in saying that I have likely fired more weapons then most of the posters on this forum. I am not afraid of guns, I am quite competent with various models, i have even toured weapon manufacturing facilities, ammunition depots, and have worked on trials and evaluations for procurement of weapons. It’s not a lack of knowledge or a fear. It’s an inability to wrap my brain around the feeling of needing a weapon to defend yourself.

[Claddagh]

@DustBunny02

Just chiming in re the social media being portrayed as fearing for her life, in one of the comments she said:

”it’s somewhat hilarious- but also possibly life threatening,- so…I guess I will laugh at the stupidity NOW- so I’m at least in hysterics when I get “whacked”.
I feel most sorry for whomever tries to bring me harm. Usually, people know better than to test me. This time, the lesson here will result in this: “ALWAYS, people know better than to test me!” (No more “usually’s”)

🤷*♀️

This woman (yes woman, we’re not talking about a less than mature teenager here, This is a nearly 40 year old adult [edit]!)

I just hope that ALL of this is known by those charged with thoroughly investigating this horror show.

[MHM]

@Claddagh

This woman (yes woman, we’re not talking about a less than mature teenager here, This is a nearly 40 year old adult [edit]!)

I just hope that ALL of this is known by those charged with thoroughly investigating this horror show.

I’m guessing that if we on the BB can find it, the police can probably find it. Especially since it was visible on her Facebook page for another two days.

[MHM]

@see u at x

Agreed. One of my ex-boyfriends drove 1,970 miles and crossed seven state lines to shoot his ex-wife’s new husband. (This happened years before we ever started dating, btw, and I did not know it until a few months into dating him.) The ex-wife had primary custody of their children and it turned out that the new husband was molesting all three of those kids. The judge in the prosecuting state ruled it a crime of passion. However, the judge also stated that what bothered him was that my ex had almost 2,000 miles and over 28 hours to think about what he was planning to do and to change his mind. My ex did not serve jail time, but was put on probation, moved to that state and was not allowed to leave the state except in the rare case of business travel or some sort of family emergency. Oh, and when he moved to that state, he then also got primary custody of his son and daughters, too.

Wait, what??

I did not see that last part coming at all. Did he kill the new husband? Or was he only wounded?

[see_u_at_x]

@MHM

Wait, what??

I did not see that last part coming at all. Did he kill the new husband? Or was he only wounded?

Sorry, I should have shared that in the first post. No, he did not kill the new husband. He was wounded, made a full recovery, faced child molestation charges, and then went to jail, IIRC.

[Toblersmom]

@AMWookey

From what people have said about the area, it’s not one where people may fear for their lives.

Sutherland is a really nice, quiet rural exurb, I go through the area regularly. Gilroy Garlic Festival is a fun family event. The (very probable) domestic violence murder was in my neighborhood, which is quite “nice”. Just because an area isn’t one prone to regular violence does not mean violence might not come, or that there are no individuals in it that fear for their lives with every justification and may find themselves in a situation where it’s kill or be killed.

Again, I have no reason to believe that there actually was self defense in this case, but that’s because I trust the complete information discovered by authorities thus far indicate murder or they would not have filed charges. I would make absolutely no assumptions of that nature in a different case, and made no such assumptions with the very early information on this case, if the only information known is that it’s not an area where “people” typically fear for their lives, because there’s a big difference between “people” and one specific person. I also make no assumptions that self defense is off the table if the only factual information available to me is that the shooter was a man and the injured or killed is a woman.

Do I, personally, carry a gun? No. Do I wish that hardly anybody in the US had guns? Yes, but the genie is way the hell out of that bottle, and there’s no stuffing him back anytime soon. Would I, personally, be able to use one of the guns in our home to kill another human if push came to shove? Probably not, honestly. Was I glad when we heard gunshots near our previous home that my husband has a robust knowledgeable of firearms and a pistol? Definitely.

[MHM]

@see u at x

Sorry, I should have shared that in the first post. No, he did not kill the new husband. He was wounded, made a full recovery, faced child molestation charges, and then went to jail, IIRC.

Wow. Interesting that of the two of them, the new husband was the one who ended up in jail. Thanks for the details.

[MHM]

@Toblersmom

Sutherland is a really nice, quiet rural exurb, I go through the area regularly. Gilroy Garlic Festival is a fun family event. The (very probable) domestic violence murder was in my neighborhood, which is quite “nice”. Just because an area isn’t one prone to regular violence does not mean violence might not come, or that there are no individuals in it that fear for their lives with every justification and may find themselves in a situation where it’s kill or be killed.

Parkland, Florida is also a very nice area. There is a cute little horse show facility with a couple of rings not far from the school. I’m sure nobody there would expect to find themselves in the situation they did a year and a half ago. But all those kids have been going through shooter drills ever since they started school, I believe. I remember doing duck and cover drills when I was a kid in school, but at least we never had to use those skills for real.

https://www.cityofparkland.org/Facil…-Temple-Park-3

[Angela_Freda]

@MHM

I’m guessing that if we on the BB can find it, the police can probably find it. Especially since it was visible on her Facebook page for another two days.

So who deleted all of it? If she’s been shot point blank twice in the chest… is she really on Facebook scrubbing her page?
And what does that say, if one is deleting all that? Hard to say it wasn’t what it looked like if, while recovering from being blasted twice, point blank in the chest, you had the energy and motivation to delete it all.

[MHM]

@Angela Freda

So who deleted all of it? If she’s been shot point blank twice in the chest… is she really on Facebook scrubbing her page?

Maybe her friends/relatives/fiancé did it for her. I saw a mention somewhere of her posting at great length while she was in the hospital, but I don’t know where that post was supposed to be. I never saw it.

And as a couple of people commented earlier in the thread, we don’t know for a fact that she was shot twice point blank in the chest. Did the police release that much detail on her wounds? Or did that information come from her fiancé or her friend? I would imagine the hospital would not release those details to anyone other than family.

[Palm_Beach]

@enjoytheride

I’ve never heard of a prosecutor waiting 5 years to file charges when the police arrive to find someone holding the shooter to the ground.

Plus, right to a speedy trial trumps the statute of limitations

Right, there is not much doubt that Barisone shot Lauren. But still, they do a complete crime scene investigation and interview all witnesses. The prosecutor won’t file charges until the investigation is complete. Once charges are filed the person being charged has a right to a speedy trial. I have yet to hear of someone demanding a speedy trial before actually being charged with with a crime.

[vagabondrider]

@MHM

Maybe her friends/relatives/fiancé did it for her. I saw a mention somewhere of her posting at great length while she was in the hospital, but I don’t know where that post was supposed to be. I never saw it.

And as a couple of people commented earlier in the thread, we don’t know for a fact that she was shot twice point blank in the chest. Did the police release that much detail on her wounds? Or did that information come from her fiancé or her friend? I would imagine the hospital would not release those details to anyone other than family.

In one of the articles linked on this page, it said Michael Barisone’s website had also been taken down. I just checked, and it is down. Also his Facebook page seems to be down. Presumably both MB & LK had family/friends/employees who did this.

[punchy]

@Angela Freda

So who deleted all of it? If she’s been shot point blank twice in the chest… is she really on Facebook scrubbing her page?
And what does that say, if one is deleting all that? Hard to say it wasn’t what it looked like if, while recovering from being blasted twice, point blank in the chest, you had the energy and motivation to delete it all.

I’m pretty sure the police get FB posts taken down when they are investigating a serious crime like this. There will be a record of everything she wrote. I think they do it both for investigative purposes (don’t want potential witnesses recollections getting swayed) and to prevent the rubbernecking lovable locals from reading everything because then you wont be able find a jury