I’m just going to say that in all the years I’ve been on this board, I don’t know if I’ve ever before seen a post with so many previous quotes in it that it came down to single characters in each line.
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Intent to kill isn’t part of self defense, make it go away, is self defence. The only intent is self-defense even if the outcome is death. You’re argument would be more compelling if you left out the intent to kill part, because it isn’t accurate.
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But he’s charged with Attempted Murder.
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[quote=“CurrentlyHorseless, post:143, topic:770123, full:true”]
That’s the problem with being able to delete posts on threads that have not been archived - just because it was said at one point doesn’t mean that you can then go back and find it later.
I did a cursory search - not wasting more than a couple minutes on it, since the post may not exist anymore - BUT - I, too, remember the statement at the time and was pretty shocked. IM has presented themselves from time to time as having better access to LK’s people that most.
Again, paraphrased, but IM insinuated at the time that LK did not hate MB as much as most would think, and would consider going back to his training.
Made me question at the time whether IM knew as much as they presented or whether there was way more to the whole story than has been presented.
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Right, but Currently horseless was talking about MBs intent to kill as being “baked into” the affirmative defense of self defense. It’s not. That’s all I was explaining.
Edited for clarity
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Okay…so statements for review…
On IM’s credibility…
Here IM claims to know “everything”
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/updated-barisone-lawsuit-10-29-21-post-851/762373/1610?u=sdel
And LK’s confirmation…
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/michael-barisone-court-date/761786/57?u=sdel
And IM on the stated of MB and LK’s feelings currently:
If LK could push a button and have MB released she’d do it:
They don’t hate each other:
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/updated-barisone-lawsuit-10-29-21-post-851/762373/1648?u=sdel
IM agrees that MB is not an evil person: https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/updated-barisone-lawsuit-10-29-21-post-851/762373/1751?u=sdel
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/updated-barisone-lawsuit-10-29-21-post-851/762373/2253?u=sdel
LK thought MB was a great trainer:
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/barisone-criminal-case-update/767426/861?u=sdel
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/court-date-for-michael-barisone/761824/3211?u=sdel
https://forum.chronofhorse.com/t/michael-barisone/321532/43?u=sdel
Since they obviously liked MB as a person and thought he was a great trainer I’m not quite sure what all the fuss about him being a horrible trainer and abusive to horses is all about.
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I remember this, too.
I understood that the recent archiving of threads related to this topic was a response to certain folk going back and deleting, editing, and sometimes even adding to their old posts, even those in locked threads.
It sets up a form of gaslighting in which a poster says something, loads of people read it, react to it, and remember it. But, if they bring it up later…poof!..it’s magically gone and then they are all smugly told, “See, you’re wrong, you cannot retrieve the post for me.”
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I was considering “intent to kill” as part of attempted murder. I was saying that by the affirmative defense, Barisone was admitting the act (shooting with intent to kill), but saying he was not responsible by reason on insanity.
I think that shooting two bullets into someone at center mass and point blank range is difficult to construe as anything other than intent to kill.
I agree with you that in a general self defense case, the act self defense does not necessarily involve intent to kill.
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That’s what I remember: ‘LK and MB may not hate each other as much as you might like to think.’
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I see what you’re saying, but I disagree with your interpretation. Self defence is yes, that person was injured, maybe killed, but my intent was to protect me. If they die, too bad, I was protecting.
This is my reading of self defense. But reasonable people can differ and the introduction of doubt is exactly where the rubber meets the road.
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I see your point, thanks.
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This could also happen during a struggle for a gun. I understand that happens not infrequently in those situations b/c the people are very close to one another during the struggle, so, if the gun discharges and someone is hit, it is what everyone’s calling “point blank” range.
Aside: as a non-gun savvy person from a no-gun culture, what is this sort of obsessive repeating of “centre mass”. Where does that come from and why is it so oft repeated?
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It’s only repeated here.
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That says that in the counterfactual situation in which MB had not been pushed by MHG into shooting LK, nearly killing her, it’s likely LK would still be training with MB.
It does not say that she is willing to train with him again now, given that he shot her.
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When using a gun for protection, people are essentially taught to shoot to “kill” and specifically aim for the torso or head, for several reasons. It is discouraged to try to aim for a leg or to merely disable.
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It’s so bizarre to read those snippets again and realize in hindsight how hard they were still trying to do character assassination on MB’s girlfriend, even years down the road after the fact.
That really jumped out as a consistent theme in a lot of those posts.
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Our interpretation differs then. LK speaks of ongoing turmoil between parties. This post seems to not concur with that narrative at all.
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I found another screenshot in which it is “guaranteed” MH will never ride in the Olympics. From December 2021.
She remains a target it seems.
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Thanks for digging all that up
Phew! I’m not nuts, after all!
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